Good IDE for C++ w/ "Visual"

[syntax0r]

I don't know what this "Visual" is before C++ 6 in Visual C++ 6 under the Visual Studio 6.0 product line.


Does this make the IDE special, as it helps users create forms visually?

Well, anyways, Im wondering if "Visual C++ 6" would be a good IDE (err, editor + compiler) to work with when learning C++.

I've heard about other C++ IDEs (or maybe they were just compilers) such as GCC.

[Martin]

No, VC++ 6 is not a good choice. Microsoft did a terrible job of implimenting the C++ standard in C++.

Go with Visual C++ .NET or Visual C++ .NET 2003.

The Visual keyword refers to your ability to create GUI's by clicking and dropping entities onto a form instead of simply coding them (visual basic style).

[md]

I use VC++.Net, but I only use it because it is an excelent IDE; I've never tried building forms or anything, but I assume that it's simplified...

[Andy]

well back in vc6... the mfc is just a pain... mfc as in microsoft fundation class, its their way of allowing implement somewhat of a visual feel into creating c++ dialog applications

[syntax0r]

So you're saying that Visual C++ .NET 2003 or just the ".NET" version (I presume it's the older version of the 2003 IDE) is the environment in which I should learn?

As I asked before on these forums, this VC.NET will potentially have incompatibility problems (on the compiled programs) with other computers.


But here's my MAIN question.

Is there a difference between the .NET VC++ (2005 Beta 2) and the Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0, aside from the fact that .NET VC++ uses the .NET framework.

[Martin]

Yes. Visual C++ 6 does a horrible job implimenting the C++ standard, which means that you will run into perfectly good code not compiling. Don't touch VC++ 6.

[Andy]

and the complier is awful... declaring the variable i in a for loop wont get wiped after the loop... the vc .net uses vc7 compiler, much much nicer

[syntax0r]

Hehehe, thank goodness for Forums.

anyways, Im seeing this VC++.net and C#.net and etc. as beta. Right now it offers a 30 day service, would I have to pay for these IDEs eventually? And I assume that the .NET 2003 Visual Studio is out and probably expensive, making me not able to use the .NET IDEs.



So, Should I use free IDEs that are similar to the Visual Studio line?

[rizzix]

well if ur interested in C#,,, just drop it and take Java. Its more mature, and more advance than the C# language. C#.2 comes closer to the latest java, but still not quite there.

Besides Java is not tied to m$. And the java community grows, faster than ever.

But if you really just want to learn a "language" i suggest you learn a functional programming language. they are a lot more interesting.

[Martin]

Unless of course you want to do stuff with graphics, in which case C# is the definate choice.

The two languages are incredibly similar though (Java and C#), and learning one when you know the other will be very easy.

[rizzix]

hmm Java is quite easy with graphics.. maybe C# is easier.. but i'd have to see code to differentiate between the two.

As for language differences.. yes they are apparent.. Java includes stuff that C# dosen't really have (as in annotations).. And C# includes stuff that java dosen't have (like operator overloading).. and then again the entire Standard library is different. Java enums are much different from enums of any other programming language (as an example of how java treats stuff differently). The same goes with the Java and C# switch statements.

Besides Java is the better choice of the two for concurrent/multithreaded programming.

[wtd]

As much as I dislike Microsoft, I'll tell you... properties make a lot of things much easier.

Consider equivalent (and largely fictional) Java and C# examples:

Java:

window.getContentPane().addWidget(buttonWidget);

[syntax="c#"]window.ContentPane.AddWidget(buttonWidget);[/syntax]

[md]

Microsoft Visual Studio 2003 .Net, and the new 2005/2006 version can be used for many languages, not just .net languages; I have MSVS 2003 .Net Enterprise Architect, and all I use it for is native C++. But VC++ 6 is definitly not what you want to be learning with, or using at all if you have a choice.

[rizzix]

are the .NET C++ libraries different from the VC++6 libraries?

[md]

rizzix:
Yes, .NET uses an interpreted library system; It's fast, and easy to use; whereas the vc6 (and 7) library use a native language library, which is perhaps faster, and doesn't provide quite the same level of utility. The main difference is that the .NET libraries are the equivalent of the standard C++ libraries, only for .NET languages, and with a lot more built in functions (mostly for graphics); the vc6 and vc7 libaries are just the windows equivalent of the standard C++ libraries.

syntax0r:
I think you might be getting confused becuase of all the .NET and C/C++ vs C#;

Microsoft Visual C++ 6 is and IDE for C++, which does a piss poor job of implementing any kind of standard.

Microsoft Visual C++ 7 (or 2003, or 2003 .NET) is the next generation IDE, it does a decent job of implementing standards. It is possible to create C++ code with which uses the .NET framework, but if your using C++, you probably want access to the normal windows API. If you don't use the .NET framework, then it just produces normal executable code that should run on any computer.

Microsoft Visual Studio 2003 .NET is a group of software packages that allow you to write code in C/C++, VB.Net, J#, and C#; as well as providing some useful tools, and a few web things. The .NET part just means that it includes the .NET framework. This includes Microsoft Visual C++ 2003 .NET

C and C++ are native languages, ie. they run on hardware. They are both low level, although C++ can be used in a semi high level fasion.

VB.NET, J#, and C# are all .NET languages, which means that they run on the .NET interpreter. It is imprtant to note that While VB.NET has some relation to visual basic, J# and C# both have more relation to Java then to C++; C++ and C# are not similar languages by any means.

So to answer yoru question, the difference between MSVC++ 6, and MSVC++ .NET +, is that the later actually implments the standards correctly.