Kyoto Protocol. CBC interview

[Cervantes]

125 nations have ratified the Kyoto Protocol on Climate Change. Even Russia has indicated to hold ratification hearings soon. This leaves the United States of America as the last holdout for agreeing to the global plan to reduce greenhouse gases. Why?
Last Saturday there was an interview on Quirks and Quarks with Ross Gelspan, author of the new book, Boiling Point: Who's to Blame for Global Warming. Mr. Gelspan lays blame for the situation in the United States on the Bush whitehouse, oil and coal industries, journalists, and the environmental activists.
I strongly urge everyone to listen to this interview. It can be found at
http://radio.cbc.ca/programs/quirks/media/2004-2005/mp3/qq-2004-10-23a.mp3
(OR go to http://radio.cbc.ca/programs/quirks/archives/04-05/oct23.html then click on the mp3 for "Who's to Blame for Global Warming")
Global Warming is a global issue and it can only be slowed by the cooperation of everybody around the world. The United States needs to join the rest of the world in slowing global warming. Awareness on this issue is of utmost importance.

[Paul]

Whats this all about, profit for the USA? Dammit. There's evidence that in 100 years the arctic won't have any ice in summer, wtf? Canada might be tropical though, or flooded

[Neo]

The Day After Tomorrow suggests that Canada will be buried under 50 feet of snow, not a tropical paradise. But what does Hollywood know?
Its gotta be the stupidest movie I've ever seen. You can survive freezing instantly when that 'eye of the storm' comes by simply building a fireplace, then why the hell did they not just set the local dump on fire and gather all around? What a stupid movie....

[templest]

Meh, I'll be dead before any significant changes in the environment occur. What the hell do I care?

[Neo]

templest wrote:

Meh, I'll be dead before any significant changes in the environment occur. What the hell do I care?

Think about your children!...........

[Paul]

OMFG! Templest's kids!

[templest]

Neo wrote:

Think about your children!...........

Meh, they'll be dead before any significant changes in the environment occur.

[Dan]

templest wrote:

Meh, they'll be dead before any significant changes in the environment occur.

Or will be dead due to them.........

[Cervantes]

Hacker Dan wrote:

templest wrote:

Meh, they'll be dead before any significant changes in the environment occur.

Or will be dead due to them.........

exactly.
no templest, your children will not be dead before any significant changes to the environment occur. no templest, you will not be dead before any significant changes to the environment occur. It's people like you, who say

Templest wrote:

What the hell do I care?

that do irreparable damage to the environment.
You have to care, because the issue of global warming is much more real than you may think. If you listened to the interview, you'd know that there is really no question about global warming: it does exist. Oil and coal companies merely flexed their power and spread their money to create the illusion that global warming was a theory, not a fact. The only question about global warming is how much time do we have left before the changes to the atmosphere spiral out of control, dooming us to oblivion?
Do you want to play a part in the annihilation of mankind? It's that serious; it can't be treated lightly by people like you, who foolishly think that it won't affect you.
Sorry for the flame, but I think that needed saying.

[templest]

Cervantes wrote:

Hacker Dan wrote:

templest wrote:

Meh, they'll be dead before any significant changes in the environment occur.

Or will be dead due to them.........

exactly.
no templest, your children will not be dead before any significant changes to the environment occur. no templest, you will not be dead before any significant changes to the environment occur. It's people like you, who say

Templest wrote:

What the hell do I care?

that do irreparable damage to the environment.
You have to care, because the issue of global warming is much more real than you may think. If you listened to the interview, you'd know that there is really no question about global warming: it does exist. Oil and coal companies merely flexed their power and spread their money to create the illusion that global warming was a theory, not a fact. The only question about global warming is how much time do we have left before the changes to the atmosphere spiral out of control, dooming us to oblivion?
Do you want to play a part in the annihilation of mankind? It's that serious; it can't be treated lightly by people like you, who foolishly think that it won't affect you.
Sorry for the flame, but I think that needed saying.

Exactly. Take it up with them, I know it's bad... etc, etc. I recognize that fact, everyone does. But I personally couldn't care less. I know I'm not the one dumping barrels of chemical waste in the ocean, and I'm not the one 0wning the rainforest. I'm not the one that didn't install the monoxoide filters in my factory's exhaust towers. I'm not the one that's routing all the city's sewage in to lake Ontario.

If one day I have a multi-billion dollar corporation, I'll take what you said into account. That's democracy for ya'.

[Cervantes]

templest wrote:

Exactly. Take it up with them, I know it's bad... etc, etc. I recognize that fact, everyone does. But I personally couldn't care less. I know I'm not the one dumping barrels of chemical waste in the ocean, and I'm not the one 0wning the rainforest. I'm not the one that didn't install the monoxoide filters in my factory's exhaust towers. I'm not the one that's routing all the city's sewage in to lake Ontario.

If one day I have a multi-billion dollar corporation, I'll take what you said into account. That's democracy for ya'.

But you are the reason that those barrels of chemical waste exist at all. You are the reason the rainforest is being destroyed: it's because you want to furnish your home with wooden furniture that the trees are being cut down, and because you need to eat that they try to justify the cutting of the trees by putting farmland there. You are the one that didn't speak up about not installing those monoxide filters. You are the reason that toronto has so much sewage that is dumped into Lake Ontario. You, the consumer, are responsible for it all, and if you, the consumer, doesn't do as much as you can to save the environment, you are ensuring the destruction of man kind, along with countless other species.
There have been five massive extinctions in the history of Earth. Mankind is creating the sixth. The sixth mass extinction will be greater than any of the others if things continue as they are. Can you really not feel guilty about being a part of this problem, about being a contributer to the extinction of countless species, as well as genuses, families, orders, classes, phylums, maybe even kingdoms.

[templest]

Cervantes wrote:

But you are the reason that those barrels of chemical waste exist at all. You are the reason the rainforest is being destroyed: it's because you want to furnish your home with wooden furniture that the trees are being cut down, and because you need to eat that they try to justify the cutting of the trees by putting farmland there. You are the one that didn't speak up about not installing those monoxide filters. You are the reason that toronto has so much sewage that is dumped into Lake Ontario. You, the consumer, are responsible for it all, and if you, the consumer, doesn't do as much as you can to save the environment, you are ensuring the destruction of man kind, along with countless other species.
There have been five massive extinctions in the history of Earth. Mankind is creating the sixth. The sixth mass extinction will be greater than any of the others if things continue as they are. Can you really not feel guilty about being a part of this problem, about being a contributer to the extinction of countless species, as well as genuses, families, orders, classes, phylums, maybe even kingdoms.
KPCOFGS

I don't discard chemical waste.
I don't buy the furniture in my house.
I've been a vegetarian for a long time, because I believe our digestive system wasn't made to be eating meat.
I don't live in Toronto.
I'm not the corporation that should be controlling their damage.
It's up to them to decide what they want to do or not.
The damage I do to this planet, is minimal compared to the damage any other person does.
You eat meat, McDonalds, coffee, and Doritos? Your shit is doing more damage to the environment than what I throw out in the garbage.
Do you even own a recycling bin for every different kind of waste that you toss out?
Fcuk, I don't care enough to worry about global warming and, indirectly, I'm probably doing more to conserve this planet than yourself.

[Cervantes]

Templest wrote:

I don't discard chemical waste.
I don't buy the furniture in my house.
I've been a vegetarian for a long time, because I believe our digestive system wasn't made to be eating meat.
I don't live in Toronto.
I'm not the corporation that should be controlling their damage.
It's up to them to decide what they want to do or not.
The damage I do to this planet, is minimal compared to the damage any other person does.
You eat meat, McDonalds, coffee, and Doritos? Your shit is doing more damage to the environment than what I throw out in the garbage.
Do you even own a recycling bin for every different kind of waste that you toss out?
Fcuk, I don't care enough to worry about global warming and, indirectly, I'm probably doing more to conserve this planet than yourself.

The consumer is reason that there is chemical waste.
Maybe you don't buy the furniture, but you are the reason it (or some of it) is there.
Good, being a vegetarian is good.
It doens't matter where you live, you still cause the same damage, london or toronto. No, you're not the corporation, but if it weren't for you, that corporation wouldn't exist, would have no market.
The damage you directly do the planet is bad enough, the fact that you don't care about the damage you do is worse still.
No, I don't eat meat, McDonalds, cofee, or Doritos. Regardless of whether or not my shit does more damage than what I throw in the garbage, mankind has been excreting feces for all his history, only recently has global warming become a major issue. only recently has mankind synthesized trash. Just because there are things that do more damage than creating trash, it does not mean that creating trash is not a problem. It does not mean that creating trash is not a fixable problem. Obviously mankind will continue to produce feces, there's nothing we can do about that. But there is something we can do about our trash. Solving the problem of trash shouldn't be swept aside just because mankind excretes feces.

You should care about global warming, beause it will affect you, because it does affect you.

Templest wrote:

indirectly, I'm probably doing more to conserve this planet than yourself.

well, directly, I doubt you are, given your attitude. Indirectly, there is no way you are, given your attitude, and given my attitude. you support the destruction of the planet, I oppose it. Indirectly, I'd say I'm doing a heck of a lot more by opposing it and trying to educate others such that they oppose it than you do by supporting it.

[templest]

Just for shits I did a quick scan of all the major furniture in the house and the only thing wooden here is my desk, everything else is some type of metal / plastic.

We throw out half a garbage-bag of trash weekly, everything else is recycled. This is a house-hold of 4.

We use fluorescent bulbs and Energy Star compliant appliances (mainly because of the tax breaks, but we still do). We don't max-out the heater and the A/C during each corresponding season.

If you're going to blame anything, blame consumerism. I've always been a strong suported of the fact that life should be about living life, not about how smooth of a ride you have. If you think about it, you can even blame the education system for this. Since it motivates us to get fancy educations so as to have high paying jobs and be able to buy more things. Blame anything but me.

The fact that I don't wear a Greenpeace badge on my sweater doesn't change the fact that my life-style isn't over-all helping the environment.

[Cervantes]

templest wrote:

If you're going to blame anything, blame consumerism.

Good god man, that's what I've been talking about the entire time. When I say "you", I don't mean you, Templest, but I mean you and the group of consumers that you belong to. I belong to them too, we all do. All I've been saying is that consumers need to tone things down and realize that, as you say, " life should be about living life".

I'm very glad to hear that you and your family are very conservative when it comes to energy consumption and garbage disposal and all those other nasty things that hurt the environment. However, the fact that you liberally voice your opinion that you don't care about climate change and that it will not harm you or your children makes me wonder: are you doing more harm than good? While you pollute less than the average family, your attitude is a major part of the global problem: if you don't care, people around you will care less. The less people care, the worse our environment will get.