CSC165H1 S - Math Expr&Rsng for CS @ UofT

[elmarsh]

Hello, I'm planning to take some computer science courses during my first year at UofT. However, I'm also planning to postpone my enrolment into a calculus course until the summer (at least) - this way I could study calculus on my own and prepare myself for MAT 137. The description for this course says the following: "Recommended preparation: first term of MAT135Y1/MAT137Y1/MAT157Y1". How much of the calculus course should I know for CSC165H1? Thanks

[hotwire]

I didn't go to UofT, but the only time that I can think of when I used calculus in my core CS courses at Waterloo was using L'Hospital's rule (a way of finding limits) in some Big O proofs. I think they recommend you take calculus mostly so that you're used to a mathematical way of thinking and are comfortable with proofs.

I just looked at the course notes: http://www.cs.utoronto.ca/~fpitt/20091/CSC165/lectures/toc.pdf - and I see nothing you need calculus for, just the ability to think logically and do proofs.

[jbking]

I didn't go to U of T, but I thought I'd add a couple of bits:
Quantifiers may be new if you haven't seen them before in Math classes. A few examples would be:

for all (Commonly written as an upside down A) a.k.a. Universal
there exists (Written as a backwards E) a.k.a. Existential or at least one
there exists uniquely (Written as a backwards E followed by an exclamation mark) a.k.a. exactly one

There may be some more Calculus coming out of the floating point arithmetic possibly.

[elmarsh]

Thanks for the posts guys!

I have seen quantifiers, I've been acquainted with them while I was studying symbolic logic.

Anyway, does anyone have any comments on holding calculus back until the summer? Will it complicate things at all? Also, if I take calculus during the summer instead, will I be in time to declare my major (and enter the program) for 2nd year?

Sorry for all the questions, but thanks for the input

[elmarsh]

hotwire @ Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:15 pm wrote:

I didn't go to UofT, but the only time that I can think of when I used calculus in my core CS courses at Waterloo was using L'Hospital's rule (a way of finding limits) in some Big O proofs. I think they recommend you take calculus mostly so that you're used to a mathematical way of thinking and are comfortable with proofs.

I just looked at the course notes: http://www.cs.utoronto.ca/~fpitt/20091/CSC165/lectures/toc.pdf - and I see nothing you need calculus for, just the ability to think logically and do proofs.

thanks for the link.. it looks like it'll be a pretty awesome course!

[[Gandalf]]

You would probably have to wait till you finish calculus, and then apply prior to entering second year. However, I would first consider how dedicated you might/might not be to taking a difficult course during the summer. Also, you may be at a slight disadvantage coming into second year math courses, because of the condensed nature of summer courses.

If you're ok with those inconveniences, or are willing to make up for it with effort, go for it.

[elmarsh]

[quote="[Gandalf] @ Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:46 am"]You would probably have to wait till you finish calculus, and then apply prior to entering second year. However, I would first consider how dedicated you might/might not be to taking a difficult course during the summer. Also, you may be at a slight disadvantage coming into second year math courses, because of the condensed nature of summer courses.

If you're ok with those inconveniences, or are willing to make up for it with effort, go for it. [/quote]

Thanks for the advice, I didn't know that the summer courses were condensed - the length of study seems to be about the same..
Anyway, I don't really have much to do over the summer so I think that I'd be okay with it. On top of that, I have a copy of Spivak's calculus book and I plan to self-study during my first year.

Do you think that I would have to wait until I'm actually done the course or do you think that I could declare my major and enter the program as I'm about to finish the course? Also, they don't discriminate against taking mandatory courses over the summer, do they?

Thanks again

[Crazymik3]

I wouldn't recommend you do 137 in summer. It's already a very challenging course during the school year, and having it compacted into the summer wouldn't be enjoyable, I imagine.

However, many say that taking 165 during the first half/before 137 helped.