3-year General vs 4-year Honours Degree (BMATH)

[jwing]

Hello everyone,

I am a second year student at the University of Waterloo and recently I have just received notice that my program is being switched from the Honours Computer Science degree to the 3-year General program because my marks are not meeting the current standards. I am feeling very disappointed in myself for letting this happen, as I do not feel like I tried anywhere near my hardest because I got into the habit of skipping classes and letting a few assignments go. I generally did do fair to decent during the duration of the course but whenever it came time for finals I would get nervous and forget what I am doing, no matter how much I studied it seems like I could never remember what I was doing.

Anyways, while thinking about this for a bit, I read on the website that it is possible to get re-admission into the Honours program given I take an absence from the University for several terms. My question is, would this be worth it to take "several terms" off? That could be a year or more off school (which seems quite long), or I could simply just go and graduate with the 3-year General Degree. How much impact would this have on me when I am trying to get a job after graduation? Would a 3-year General Degree suffice for a Computer Science job? Or any decent job at least?

Thanks for listening to my story.

[Tony]

I don't know the details of "several terms", it might be "several years" -- long enough for the University to drop your transcript and admit you as a new student. Details become important.

Another option to consider is continuing at another University that either doesn't have the same requirements (in terms of number of failed classes on transcript) or that will let you drop failed classes from the record.

UW's General Math requires less credits and has easier classes than CS, but it still has transcript requirements of UW's Math Faculty (although less strict than CS). Ultimately if you continue skipping classes and assignments, then UW might not let you finish General Math either.

If you are set on getting a CS Honours, specifically from UW, what would you do in your time off?

[jwing]

I would rather stay at the University of Waterloo as it is a great school if possible, and I am really hoping to get a degree here. I also feel it may be too much of a hassle to transfer to another university that may be "less reputable" than UW, yet have a similar difficulty (and thus resulting in me digging an even deeper hole to my situation). I would definitely consider it if the Honours degree is really worth it, but for now UW is really preferable.

As for skipping classes, those habits are long gone as it seemed to just be a first year habit, believe me after what happened I do not think I will be trying that approach anymore.

If I were to take several terms off to get into CS Honours, I would probably be working for experience which may assist me greatly after my graduation. I could work into easing in a decent work habit and have it carry out into great University habits. Although the question of whether I would want to take several "terms" (or years for that matter), would really be a difficult one to answer, it entirely depends how worth it an Honours degree is over a General one.

[Prabhakar Ragde]

I'm sorry to hear that poor work habits have forced you out of Honours CS. You are not alone in this. I think this is the major cause of people leaving the program.

I've heard some students assert with some certainty that employers don't care about 3-yr General vs 4-yr Honours, but I am not sure I believe it. It may be the case for jobs where a Bachelor's is kind of a generic qualification. But most courses in the CS major (and others) are closed to you in General. Some of the more interesting jobs would probably be closed to you as a result. On the other hand, if you do well in the program, and keep up extracurricular CS involvement, you may be able to overcome such hurdles.

You should speak to a CS advisor about the possibility of returning to the Honours program eventually. The only thing I can find in the calendar about "several terms" involves students who complete and request a General degree and then try to upgrade it to an Honours degree. That is not your situation. It seems to me that sufficiently good performance in General might get you back into Honours, but an advisor would know for sure.

[Bobrobyn]

I do know that if you want to do grad studies, you need the honours year. Other than that, I'm not sure. At the University of Guelph, we're just required to have a particular Computing and Information Science (CIS) average upon graduation. Is there no chance of pulling up your average to get readmitted? I'd talk to a program councilor or whatever the equivilent is at Waterloo.

[Tony]

It's not about your average, it's mostly about the number of failed courses on the trascript's record. It's possible to petition and get administration to drop a term and nullify some of the failed credits (allowing you to once again fulfill the requirements to continue with honours), but it's a complicated process. It's best you speak with an advisor and see what they suggest.