Dungeons and Dragons

[Zeroth]

Any fans/players of Dungeons and Dragons here? I assume there must be. What are your thoughts on 4e?

[btiffin]

Used to be a huge fan.

Then Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay flushed D&D from my system. I still try and keep up ... have many many Dragon magazines (a few of which have an ad for my Monster Romp game in them - wicked expense that). I have close to two full 8x4 ft bookcases of TSR materials and as I age I keep threatening myself to donate it all to a library.

I stopped buying AD&D material just before release 3, but I like the open concept and I've been trying to convince a few clubbers (not very aggressively mind) to help write up an Ottawa based city adventure. Use a current map of Parliament Hill and Byward Market and barely tweak it for use in the Realms. I think it would be pretty cool. And could lead to a whole line of actual city -> fantasy map, short modules.

If/when the urge retakes I'll probably pick up the new release, more for reading than playing. And I'm hoping to start seeing 3rd ed materials showing up in the bargain bins.

Gary Gygax is definitely one of my heroes. He will be missed. I pick up any works of his that I can. I was looking forward to Dangerous Journeys catching on, but alas ...

Cheers
And to end. Warhammer RULEZ!

[Insectoid]

btiffin @ Sun Jul 13, 2008 11:35 am wrote:

Used to be a huge fan.

Then Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay flushed D&D from my system.
And to end. Warhammer RULEZ!

Good on ya, mate!

[PianoScry]

i play DND because Warhammers pretty expensive if I am correct

[Insectoid]

I haven't got a job and still can afford warhammer, though I'll shut up now because there already is a warhammer thread where I can talk about it if I wish.

[Zeroth]

Dungeons and Dragons can be a lot of fun. We have a few rules, like no meta-gaming, have fun for fun's sakes. Its especially awesome when our kleptomaniac female rogue halfling steals, well, something, yet again. For example, she stole... some hair and skin from a dead kobold. Or... a bedpan. Clean bedpan, but still a bedpan.

Theres other very hilarious roleplay, for example when the drunk male members of the party decide to flirt with the sober female Elandrin ranger. Or just... any man flirts with her. DnD gives an option for roleplay, lots of it... does warhammer do roleplay as well?

[Aziz]

I'm sure you could roleplay in Warhammer, but not like D&D. You're a general, rather than a character, and you pretty much direct a war rather than go on an adventure. The thing about D&D, is it requires a commitment and other people in order to be fun. I've never played before, but I can't imagine it's much fun alone.

[Zeroth]

Thats another reason why I'm enjoying DnD. Its a lot of fun, meet new people, share a common adventure over several months or so. I only really explored the mathematics because I was curious, and math is fun. I learned lots of new stuff, and I understand just how probabilities work now. And how often they can come over and screw me over.

[Zeroth]

[Off-topic... why am I still stuck at 99 posts?]

[gitoxa]

Because you're posting in the Off Topic forum; Post counts don't raise.

[Zeroth]

ah...

[btiffin]

Aziz @ Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:50 pm wrote:

I'm sure you could roleplay in Warhammer, but not like D&D. You're a general, rather than a character, and you pretty much direct a war rather than go on an adventure. The thing about D&D, is it requires a commitment and other people in order to be fun. I've never played before, but I can't imagine it's much fun alone.

I'm talking about Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay. Different game than Warhammer Fantasy Battle. WFRP is pen and paper, WFB is miniatures, props and huge bags of cash and time.

WFRP rocks. An order of magnitude better imho. Written so your suspension of disbelief is far easier to maintain and lasts for longer stretches of play time. Darker colder roleplaying. You do have "hit points", Wounds, but only a couple. And when they go, you risk arms, legs and the ever popular Critical Hits table with entries like; Your opponents entrails spill to the floor splashing blood over a four foot radius. Death is instantaneous. And no, a cleric then doesn't run over and raise you back. A necromancer might raise you back ... as a zombie, or skeleton a few years later. Dark place is the Known World of Warhammer. Magic items are rare, special and totally cool. Dirt is everywhere and the Watch is out to get you as much as are the forces of Chaos.

I can't find the reference, but I once read that if you add up all the times humans have attacked each other with weapons (in real life ... not movies), the attack killed or maimed 80% of the time. So, in real life, if someone swings a sword, someone else goes down - 8 times out of 10. D&D (Hollywood) would have you believe otherwise.

But, GW keeps Warhammer under lock and key. WoC is a lot more open to community involvement and expansions by third parties, so D&D does have an advantage for the potential for "fun".

Keeping things on D&D, I usually DM'ed games when I played (years ago now), but I always brought along a party NPC half-elf cleric with dog. Painted up quite nicely if I must say so meself. Faints at the slightest fear, but can usually drag a party member from the brink once he wakes up. And the dog is great for flavouring the random monster encounters. When the roll came up, well - blame Clover - she barked again, and within a few turns, whatta you know. (And just as likely to assist with surprise, so players had it both ways.) I found that combination a great way of keeping up the ever rare, and usually fleeting, suspension of disbelief.

Cheers

[DemonWasp]

I'm a huge fan of both DnD and Warhammer (40k, nobody I know plays Fantasy, so I don't know it). I guess I'm really lucky to have that kind of disposable income.

On DnD: 3.5e is a pretty sweet. The game system allows for an awesome amount of customisation: you can play anything from your typical swords-and-heroes game (DMing one for my family at the moment), to pirates (DMing one for my friends, via play-by-forum), to the darker worlds of RP. The system may be built to run a specific way, but it doesn't take a terrible amount of knowledge to twist it a little and play whatever you'd like.

I just wish my players could remember that magic missile is 1d4+1 per missile *sigh*.

@btiffin: If you don't like raise dead, resurrection or true resurrection then there's nothing to say that those have to be allowed. Assuming you're running your own game, just ban them (telling your players, of course), or make them incredibly rare / valuable. DnD is, of course, much more fantasy material than WFR, so it may still not appeal.

[btiffin]

@DemonWasp
re raise dead.

I don't know. Playing WFB puts me in the "get'em" frame of mind; playing D&D puts me in a high fantasy "everybody lives to collect a +12 sword today" frame, so in D&D adventures I usually bend the rules in favour of the players. Not so in Warhammer. My Warhammer players make a mistake, they lose a toe. For instance, some noob troll slayers were out looking to get killed in battle. Informing them that, yeah that could be likely, I offered up a daemon. In Warhammer you run from unknown daemons, but true to form and in character the dwarves advanced, willing to put life to risk in atonement for past mistakes. So one of the smart players gets into a mental duel, the daemon wanting to play, and thinking he'd rid the table of the model, intices the daemon to recite PI. His character is still stuck somewhere in the void, listening to the insane voice of a daemon reciting the infinite digits.

I exaggerate about the +12 swords of course - Monty Haul roleplaying is fun for about 2 minutes. Then it's just boring and broken. But I was a fan of handing out +1 underwear (some with a subtle power they won't be told about) to players early on in any campaigns I've run, D&D being that kinda game to me.

And as a hint to GMs, put your players through the wringer re comfort. Every camp, make sure they know how itchy life was back in the day. Rain is uncomfortable in wool, warm but uncomfortable. Leather? Let them freeze. Chainmail? Well every move is a new shock of cold metal to some unsuspecting skin.

Make sure they either have some kinda reserve, reg army experience (or something like farming or fishing) or spend some time explaining what a (short) 10K hike with 60 pounds is really like on the feet. Even dare them to contemplate walking across town with ohh, say 4 gallons of milk. Only forty pounds, but think about the inconvenience of walking with 4 jugs and not just two. Anyway, the games where I could convince the players they felt wet and shitty, they always seemed to have the most fun, and the surrounding adventures were the ones repeated in later conversations.

Cheers