Software Engineering: UFT or Waterloo?

[Banished_Outlaw]

I did a lot of research and its really hard to choose between one of them. UFT has PEY, Waterloo has co-op. UFT is in downtown so its not boring but that may distract me from my studies. Whereas Waterloo doesnt have much to offer, so I will stay focused on my studies or get really bored and give up? UFT is closer to my house so I wont have to go live in residence but for Waterloo, I will. but i also heard that waterloo residence is not good. is that also true? I want to work for Microsoft or Google after i graduate. Do these companies and other big ones hire from both these universities or do they give preference to one? Any information will be helpful. Thanks.

[rizzix]

M$ ==> Waterloo.

[Tony]

What rizzix said.

Microsoft and Google are all over Waterloo, though I'm sure that they pick up students from UofT (or where-ever they find someone they like) as well. Though I believe Microsoft has quoted a "statistic" that they "hire more students from Waterloo than any other University".

Some residences are better than others. Aim for a suite style residence. Most of the surrounding area is also rented out to students, so you and some friends could rent an entire house together (I know a lot of people doing that).

Personally I find it that you get a lot more work done if you live close enough to the campus to casually go to the library, meet up with classmates, and study. Living home with parents might be cheaper, but it's usually much more anti-social. You should also consider that TTC commute sucks.

[Banished_Outlaw]

thanks rizzix and tony, thats really helpful. Hmm but waterloo doesnt have much to offer in terms of entertainment? i dont like to study all the time....i like to take a break now and then...go watch a movie and stuff.....and everyone refers to waterloo as a boring village? is that true?

[Tony]

Banished_Outlaw @ Tue May 20, 2008 8:47 pm wrote:

and everyone refers to waterloo as a boring village? is that true?

No.

The University experience is largely what you make it be. Waterloo is obviously smaller than Toronto, and can't compete with the variety of downtown night clubs... but... I think you should just come out here and see for yourself. 1.5 hour drive is a small investment when compared to your 4~5 year stay at the University of choice.

[Banished_Outlaw]

true...i visited uft campus, im gonna go check out waterloo campus soon too. thank u so much tony!

[Dan]

My personal obeserations of U of T and waterloo would sugest that U of T's culter is more combatbale with google and waterloo's is more combatale with microsoft.

I blive U of T uses Python in some clases witch is a plus to what google's programers use and U of T does have some profs that are very intrestest in open source and the open source comunitys, witch is also a big plus with google.

On the other hand Waterloo had a deal with microsoft to use C# and other micosoft langues that would be a big pluse to micosoft and the waterloo atiuide is more fiting with what i pitucer microsofts to be.

As an example of the diffrence in culters between microsoft and google, working on and having exprice with open source on your resume would help you at google but could hurt you at microsoft.

I am sure both companys will hire students from both schools and both probly care more about your expricen and skills then what school you came from but there are signifcat buisness cultuer diffrences between the two companys, so you might want to decied witch path you want to travel down.

[Prabhakar Ragde]

The deal with C# was between ECE at UW and Microsoft. CS and SE were not part of it and do not use C#. In fact, we're using open-source software in first year.

In 2007, Google hired more people from UW than from any other university.

Dan is right that there's a significant difference in corporate culture between Microsoft and Google, but that has more to do with who you are than with what the university you attend is like. Universities are big, sprawling places filled with a diverse set of people, and even if they tried to mold you in a particular way (which they don't), chances are they wouldn't succeed.

[Banished_Outlaw]

so can i go to uft, coz i kinda want to? and get a good job in google or microsoft based upon my marks and PEY experience? also one of the reasons i want to go to UFT is that they have the jeffrey skoll program where students can earn their Bachelor's degree in engineering, a professional experience year, a management internship, and an MBA in six years and eight months. It sounds perfect but then again, waterloo's co-op is really good in itself. does anyone know more about UFTs jeffrey skoll program?

[Dan]

Banished_Outlaw @ 21st May 2008, 5:44 pm wrote:

so can i go to uft, coz i kinda want to?

Well if you want to go to U of T then you probly should. As tony metioned above, what you get out of univerisity is more up to you then the university. If you have the knowalge, tallent and drive microsoft and/or google will probly hire you from any university in canada. So pick the university you think you will personal do best at and be able to learn best at.

@Prabhakar Ragde, i think a more intresting statstic might be what % of students make it from first year to google or microsoft as the number that are hired is mostly depened on how many CS undergrads the university is pumping out. Tho my guses is most universitys do not keep that kind of information on hand.

[Tony]

All that data is available on UW's co-op database. It might not be readily available, but someone with access to student profile information (so anyone on administrative staff) can figure out this number.

[Prabhakar Ragde]

Dan: you're right that the size of a program has a lot to do with "X hires more students from Y" statements. The hard numbers, contrary to what Tony says, are locked up pretty tight, due to Ontario privacy regulations, and we probably don't even have some of them (graduates are under no obligation to tell us where they're working). My point is that there simply aren't strong enough "university cultures" at these two institutions to be able to link them with the more distinctive "corporate cultures" of places like Google and Microsoft. We have plenty of fierce open-source partisans in our student body and among our faculty.

I also agree that if the OP wants to go to U of T, they should.

[PaulButler]

The percent of students who get hired by MS or Google might be an interesting statistic, but I would hardly base my university choice on it. It sounds like you want to go to UFT, so go with your gut if that's the case.

If you have a good reason to live at home (rez is expensive, etc.), by all means, live at home. But it sounds like you are just thinking of living of home if you go to UFT because it's the natural thing to do. If that's the case, I would encourage you to think about living in rez anyway. UFT has some nice residences (I'm staying at their Woodsworth residence for the summer, and it is quite nice), and you have a chance to meet other first-years and make friends.

[Banished_Outlaw]

thanks a lot u guys, this forum really helped me a lot. After much thinking and soul searching, i have decided to go to waterloo co - op software engineering. Once again, thanks a lot for all the help =)

[coreyxjessica]

Tony @ Tue May 20, 2008 6:38 pm wrote:

What rizzix said.

Microsoft and Google are all over Waterloo, though I'm sure that they pick up students from UofT (or where-ever they find someone they like) as well. Though I believe Microsoft has quoted a "statistic" that they "hire more students from Waterloo than any other University".

Some residences are better than others. Aim for a suite style residence. Most of the surrounding area is also rented out to students, so you and some friends could rent an entire house together (I know a lot of people doing that).

Personally I find it that you get a lot more work done if you live close enough to the campus to casually go to the library, meet up with classmates, and study. Living home with parents might be cheaper, but it's usually much more anti-social. You should also consider that TTC commute sucks.

That's only because they're the smartest kids you can get that have not abandoned Windows completely. Look at MIT and their preference for open source and Unix based Operating Systems.