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Linux

Author:	SuperGenius [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 5:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Linux
I've always wondered about it as an alternative to windows, but I dont know much about it. I read on the linux.org web site, but I do have some questions. 1. What are some main advantages/disadvantages vs. windows 2. is it possible (and if so how difficult) to install it as a secondary OS on my computer. 3. I thought about installing it on my old laptop, which only I use so I can freely mess with it, any thoughts on that?

Author:	Paul [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 5:51 pm ]
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OOO, I'd like to know about question 2's answers, installing win XP and win 98 on the same computer is no problem, but I dunno about linux and windows.

Author:	roer [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 6:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Linux
SuperGenius wrote: I've always wondered about it as an alternative to windows, but I dont know much about it. I read on the linux.org web site, but I do have some questions. 1. What are some main advantages/disadvantages vs. windows 2. is it possible (and if so how difficult) to install it as a secondary OS on my computer. 3. I thought about installing it on my old laptop, which only I use so I can freely mess with it, any thoughts on that? 1) More freedom, friendlier community, nicer feel, more customizable. You have to try it out on your own, its hard to explain. Disadvantages would be if your a hardcore gamer, theres some Linux ports (UT2003, UT2K4) but if you try to run games with WINE your going to suffer major frame rate loss. Linux has its fair share of games though =) 2) You have to partition your hard drive for a Linux sector, the options avaliable in the installation, not hard to do 3) I experiment with Linux on a P120, its better to use it on an older machine for learning IMO, no idea why, just feels more natural

Author:	SuperGenius [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 6:04 pm ]
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Also i would like to know about the stability of such a configuration, because if i installed linux on my primary computer and got an error, i would find my neck on the chopping block very quickly.

Author:	templest [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 9:19 pm ]
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I run Linux as my main OS. I just have a super small Windows XP partition setup up aside so as to use the system files with "Wine", Windows compatability layer for Linux. So I run basically all my Windows apps in Linux, including games. Having installed Linux from pure source-code, built specifically for my machine, gentoo linux, I can say I know quite a bit. One thing though, http://justlinux.com <- the hugest linux forums you'll ever see in your life. You ask a question there and within minutes you'll get an answer, and whataever the question is, it's most likeley already been answered, even the ones you asked above. Just use the 'search' function. As for you, I'd go with one of the three: Fedora Core2, Mandrake 10, or Slackware 9.1. Those are the three most mainstream distro's that are bound to work 100% with your PC no matter how newbish you are. They provide the easiest and fastest installs too. as opposed to the 3 days of compiling and tweaking with the gentoo installation 'process'. You will feel the effects though. Mandrake with KDE graphic environment will give you the same performance as windows. Slackware is the fastest of the three distro's but provides less bells and whistles. You get a small, clean, linux install with the GUI of your choice. Mandrake or Fedora are the best choice for you, as the installation is pretty much exactly the same as Windows. Once you gain some experience though you can go for slackware. Once you have a year or two under your belt, I defenetly suggest gentoo. It'll be FAWKING FAST!!!. My gentoo boot-up time from begining of load to main console is 4 seconds. Where'as Mandrake is around 10. Whatever strikes your fancy, I guess. As for those forums, you must get an account there. If it wheren't for those forums, I'd have ditched linux a long time ago. -templest EDIT: What do you mean 'frame rate loss'? I run Warcraft III just as fine with any linux OS as I do with Windows XP. Actually, Counter-Strike seems to run better in OpenGL mode with Linux.

Author:	Paul [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 9:26 pm ]
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templest wrote: My gentoo boot-up time from begining of load to main console is 4 seconds. no shit? Wow, now Im seriously considering it...

Author:	SuperGenius [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 9:35 pm ]
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so where would I go looking for information and perhaps a download of the versions you mentioned? ps. I am good with computers, but i know nothing about linux, although I learn quickly..

Author:	jonos [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 10:11 pm ]
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I've only used Slackware and Knoppix. If you have never tried Linux I would suggest trying Knoppix which you download as a cd image, burn to a cd, and then boot straight from the cd and you don't have to install anything. You may have to change the boot sequence in the BIOS though, but that isn't hard. With Knoppix you can decide if you like the file system and the GUI (I think it comes with KDE), etc. It is not as stable as some but at least you will get a feeling as to what it is like. http://www.knoppix.org/

Author:	roer [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 10:39 pm ]
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Dont start with gentoo....its just suicide. Start with Fedora Core2 or Mandrake 10, they're great learning platforms. After you've twideled around a bit and understand how Linux works then go on into installing Gentoo. And get ready for a hefty 8 hour installation

Author:	Martin [ Thu Jun 10, 2004 11:20 pm ]
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Gentoo is really hard to setup, you're thrown in a bash prompt right away. Go with Debian linux. Fedora Core is junk, and it's an rpm distro (meaning that it uses these rpm files, which are useless). Also, Fedora is modded to the point of inoperability Mandrake has the same problem. Debian has an awesome little command called apt-get. Read this tutorial I wrote on installing debian.

Author:	SuperGenius [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 2:36 pm ]
Post subject:
Darkness which version do you use?

Author:	jonos [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 4:32 pm ]
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Really, try Knoppix just to make sure that you like it. You don't have to partition your hard drive, you don't have to install anything, etc. Then if you don't like Linux all you have is a Knoppix CD and nothing Linux on your computer.

Author:	templest [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 5:18 pm ]
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roer wrote: Dont start with gentoo....its just suicide. Start with Fedora Core2 or Mandrake 10, they're great learning platforms. After you've twideled around a bit and understand how Linux works then go on into installing Gentoo. And get ready for a hefty 8 hour installation 8 Hours? Did you do a Stage 3 installation? Mine took 3 days!

Author:	SuperGenius [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 5:40 pm ]
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ouch... how does it take 3 days to install?

Author:	roer [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 5:47 pm ]
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templest wrote: roer wrote: Dont start with gentoo....its just suicide. Start with Fedora Core2 or Mandrake 10, they're great learning platforms. After you've twideled around a bit and understand how Linux works then go on into installing Gentoo. And get ready for a hefty 8 hour installation 8 Hours? Did you do a Stage 3 installation? Mine took 3 days! ive never attempted a gentoo installation yet, my friends have, maybe they were just lieing about it i dont know...ill see when i try it out after exams SuperGenius wrote: ouch... how does it take 3 days to install? you compile your own kernel, takes a looooong while

Author:	templest [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 6:55 pm ]
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roer wrote: templest wrote: roer wrote: Dont start with gentoo....its just suicide. Start with Fedora Core2 or Mandrake 10, they're great learning platforms. After you've twideled around a bit and understand how Linux works then go on into installing Gentoo. And get ready for a hefty 8 hour installation 8 Hours? Did you do a Stage 3 installation? Mine took 3 days! ive never attempted a gentoo installation yet, my friends have, maybe they were just lieing about it i dont know...ill see when i try it out after exams SuperGenius wrote: ouch... how does it take 3 days to install? you compile your own kernel, takes a looooong while Not just that. You compile the ENTIRE FAWKING OPERATING SYSTEM! 3 days of non-stop compiling. That's part of the reason the thing boots up so fast. The whole OS is built just for my machine. EDIT: Also, I'd recommend, if you install gentoo, to make a back-up DVD of the freshly installed OS, right after you're done, the first thing you do is back it all up, for obvious reasons. If you break that damned thing, you'll commit suicide before taking another 3 days from your life to reinstall it.

Author:	SuperGenius [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:19 pm ]
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roer wrote: you compile your own kernel, takes a looooong while what sort of knowledge is required for this?

Author:	roer [ Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:25 am ]
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SuperGenius wrote: roer wrote: you compile your own kernel, takes a looooong while what sort of knowledge is required for this? Installation guide : http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook-x86.xml a prior understanding to linux would be nice, you dont want to go 1/3 through the installation and get stuck at a part really does sound tempting now templest....gets old rig ready

Author:	templest [ Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:45 am ]
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As for that hanbook, I myself saved the printable copy on-to a CD and went to the closest kinko's to get a binder/book hardcopy of it printed out. You'll want to keep it handy. You can't get around this, if you DON'T read the book, you're not going to get very far in the installation. But if you do it "by the book" step by step, exactly as it says, you won't have any trouble getting it installed. It's VERY damned detailed.

Author:	Martin [ Sat Jun 12, 2004 1:38 pm ]
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SuperGenius wrote: Darkness which version do you use? Right now I'm in the midst of doing a Stage1 install of Gentoo linux. For the hell of it. I'm using Debian as well.

Author:	roer [ Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:20 pm ]
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btw, in case anyone is looking for distro's heres a nice organized site http://www.linuxiso.org/

Author:	SuperGenius [ Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:46 pm ]
Post subject:
Which version do you reccomend for a first time linux user, with a p1 133mhz system? (ie. me)

Author:	Martin [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 2:09 am ]
Post subject:
Debian.

Author:	SuperGenius [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 9:17 am ]
Post subject:
ok, but i've got another question. If im using linux i think i might throw up because of nightmares of careers class if i had to use openoffice to word process. I read about a windows emulator... would that allow me to run word still using linux?

Author:	SuperGenius [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 9:22 am ]
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I looked up debian on that site that was mentioned earlier, but im confused.... there are so many versions.. which should I pick? http://www.linuxiso.org/distro.php?distro=4

Author:	Dark Matter [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 3:23 pm ]
Post subject:
I have a question: If I create a file (a program, just for arguments sake) on one version of linux, say Yellow Dog, will the file work with all other versions, such as Red Hat, Debian, etc?

Author:	Catalyst [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 4:27 pm ]
Post subject:
not in that case since yellow dog is for the ppc while the others you mentioned are x86

Author:	rizzix [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 7:19 pm ]
Post subject:
dunt be so hasty.. u should try it out.. but i dunt recommend it as a workstation OS. its better of a server OS. why? "drivers". ok so u may be lucky to find some drivers for linux for the more "popular" devices available out there, but there are not many. generic drivers work but u loose a lot on performance and for wht u've paid for.. thats one reason why i agree with the guy who said something to the effect that, it fells better having linux installed on an older computer. an OS is considered a good workstation os if it can take full advantage of the all devices and cards installed on ur comp. on this score.. windows is still a better os. but dunt worry there are new projects being created for so called "opensource drivers"; and they are specially designed for linux in mind. if ur looking for compatibility i suggest these distros: - RedHat - SuSE if ur looking for a secure "server" OS: - Turstix if ur looking for mainstream OS: - Debain - Gentoo NOTE: mainstream OS are really for geeks. heh. i mean try them out only if ur comfortable with linux. they may not be too easy to use.. but they are highly cuztomizable. ALSO NOTE: i dunt recommend trying out those so called introductory os, that "introduce u to the linux world". they really suck, specailly mandrake (a redhat ripoff) In any case.. i suggest SuSE the most all rounded better off workstation OS. it has a lot of support from various companiesout there, and also has quite a variety of drivers built for it.

Author:	Martin [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 11:11 pm ]
Post subject:
OpenOffice isn't so bad.

Author:	SuperGenius [ Mon Jun 14, 2004 4:14 pm ]
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I wont pass judgement on it until i have tried running it on linux, but oh my.... in the careers centre I hated it so much because it was so slow, and because of the stupid, stupid projects we had to do in there.

Author:	jonos [ Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:54 pm ]
Post subject:
OpenOffice is fast even when run from the Knoppix CD. It has everyone one would ever really need unless you use all the extra MSOffice stuff.

Author:	SuperGenius [ Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:17 pm ]
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I didnt use it that much... are it's designed uses similar to that of office XP?

Author:	jonos [ Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:57 pm ]
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Yeah. If you have no problem with OfficeXP then you will have no problem with OpenOffice.

Author:	templest [ Fri Jun 18, 2004 9:54 pm ]
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I have both installed Office 2k3 and OO.org installed. I use OO.org more though, just because it's so much more customizable than Office. As a minor but very cool example, you can customize your own shortcuts to do different things. It's great for subscripts, superscripts and special characters when writing up physics labs. You can also use OO.org to writeup PDFs, something that Office, to my knowledge, doesn't do (at least not yet).

Author:	zylum [ Sun Jun 20, 2004 5:48 pm ]
Post subject:
i just d/l the 4 disks of mandrake files and am having trouble burning them... what data mode are the isos? (data mode 1 or 2?), is it raw data? and what is the block size? (2048 or 2352?) i am using nero and it says: The entered block size does not correspond to the image length. the block size may be wrong. do you want to correct the value or ignore the problem? i choose correct but i dont know what the settings should be... any help?

Author:	SuperGenius [ Sun Jun 20, 2004 6:26 pm ]
Post subject:
What are some sites where I would find stuff to download for linux, like the OS and OO and other programs? If I am going to try it I will need some software to go with it.

Author:	templest [ Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:09 pm ]
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Don't correct it. Just ingnore the error all together. The same thing happened to me, I chose to ignore it, and after burning the installation went fine.

Author:	templest [ Sun Jun 20, 2004 8:21 pm ]
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And if you want apps for linux, http://freshmeat.net is your friend. Just type whatever you need in the search criteria and you'll find an app to do it, lots of them actually. There's everything, It's like google for finding Linux apps. As an example, type: "word processor" and you'll see OO.org in there. Along with AbiWord, Kword/Kwrite, eMacs, ect. type "media player" and you'll get XMMS, Xine, MPlayer, ect. Have fun.

Author:	Martin [ Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:39 pm ]
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also check out www.kdelook.org and www.kdeapps.org

Author:	Mazer [ Mon Jun 21, 2004 6:54 am ]
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Has anybody here tried using enlightenment? I think it'd be cool with the seperate scrollable desktops but it's so different and strange to use. (does it come with a file manager I don't know about )

Author:	templest [ Mon Jun 21, 2004 10:19 am ]
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Darkness wrote: also check out www.kdelook.org and www.kdeapps.org Those are apps that only work for the KDE. In otherwords, if you want to use them, and you're using GNOME. You'll have to waste time compiling, and installing KDE just to use those apps, which is a waste of HD space and time. But if you do use KDE, yeah.. go for it, I guess. As for Enlightenment. It's a crazy UI. If you uber tweak it out, you could make it look a thousand times prettier than OS X, and make it have translucencies and rotating menus, a little ballete on your desktop with not that much resources. Too bad it has no file manager.

Author:	Mazer [ Mon Jun 21, 2004 10:34 am ]
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Darn, I'm too lazy and stupid to do stuff with command line... ah well. But it's still pretty weird to have a desktop and no icons on it.

Author:	SuperGenius [ Fri Jun 25, 2004 5:41 pm ]
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two questions: 1. If i try to partition my hard drive is it certain or probable that I will lose data? 2. Will I be able to connect to my lan using linux? I am 99% sure that it is centralized around the router, rather than a proxy.

Author:	Mazer [ Fri Jun 25, 2004 9:09 pm ]
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SuperGenius wrote: 1. If i try to partition my hard drive is it certain or probable that I will lose data? Maybe, I would think so. See if you have an old hard drive lying around... or just back stuff up and format (I like formatting!). SuperGenius wrote: 2. Will I be able to connect to my lan using linux? I am 99% sure that it is centralized around the router, rather than a proxy. Sure. Ignoring the part about centralized and proxy... yes.

Author:	SuperGenius [ Fri Jun 25, 2004 9:13 pm ]
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I had to reconnect it to the network today under windows to do stuff, and it was a pain... does linux (im going to try debian on darkness' advice..) come with the needed stuff to connect it to networks or do I have to hunt down some utility?

Author:	Mazer [ Fri Jun 25, 2004 9:27 pm ]
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I don't know about debian (might try that out something because of it's rhyming potential alone), but I installed mandrake and setting up my network connection was simply picking which ethernet card to use.

Author:	templest [ Tue Jul 06, 2004 6:22 pm ]
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SuperGenius wrote: I had to reconnect it to the network today under windows to do stuff, and it was a pain... does linux (im going to try debian on darkness' advice..) come with the needed stuff to connect it to networks or do I have to hunt down some utility? It depends on what distro you have. Say what distro you're getting, what router (if any), and what ISP you have, and I'll write a mini-howto on how to get it working.

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