Computer Science Canada Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
| Author: | Insectoid [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
I have always loved 3-D and simulations, like airplane cockpits which contain the controls and display for flight simulations, for example. I have often wondered how far one could take these simulations, imagining such things a network of the aforementioned cockpits to create multiplayer dogfights. I've wondered about computer monitors that curve for a 360? view that rotates the character of a game as the player rotates inside the monitor. Today, I thought up something truly epic. Imagine large area, very plain, filled with nondescript objects, henceforth called the arena. Quite boring. But when you put on your helmet, it turns into a cramped corridor in a battleship. Your gray, plastic suit is replaced with high-tech combat armor and the stick you once held is now a laser gun. Such is my dream. In theory, it's entirely possible. Compelling three-dimensional worlds are creatable, as proven by the film Avatar. Objects such as blocks or walls are tracked by cameras seeing their reflective surfaces (or, as would be more accurate, more expensive and more fun, an Arena Positioning System, or APS, working along the same lines as conventional GPS) which the computer then reskins into it's virtual counterpart and displays to the user. To reduce the work for the computer, a server would take in data from the APS, calculate coordinates of all objects and players and send that data to individual clients which render images, and send them wirelessly to the helmet worn by the player. It would use a goggle system, with both lenses displaying slightly different images so that the brain can combine them itself, yielding the most realistic 3-D image and the least 'simulation sickness' that many people succumb to while viewing 3-D films. Special gloves would record your hand movements, and a series of APS sensors in the player's suit's limbs would allow the computer to display each player in the exact (or close enough) pose that he is actually in. Wind and rain, and temperature control, would be easy to add (don't know how hard it would be to animate realistic rain). I don't this is quite possible yet, as hardware is too slow to give a smooth virtual-physical reality. It would be quite strange to touch something before you saw yourself touching it. I don't know how small the GPS receivers in objects and suits could be made, but if they can't be made small enough yet, they will be soon (I assume they are around the size of a watch at the moment, but I may be horribly underestimating the extent of the technology). The screens in each goggle lens would have to be extremely high resolution, somewhere around 1000x1000 (which is very good considering the screens would measure around 1" by 1"). But hey, that may well be possible in ten or twenty years. Fiber-optic cards, which are currently in the works, could dramatically reduce lag. Anyway, this would be great technology for the military and for recreation. Once the hardware and software exists, making a new environment is as easy as building new plastic blocks (can't be more than a couple hundred bucks each at most) and creating skins for them in a 3-D animation program such as 3dsMax (or whatever it's called), as well as a skybox and horizon. Within a couple weeks, you could turn a city into a castle, and switching back could be done in a day (just swapping out blocks and walls and selecting a different environment from a list of existing ones). Hell, different players could have different themes. A fantasy fan could play in a castle while a science buff could play in a futuristic bastion. Same physical zone, different virtual one. Virtual reality visors have existed for a long time, but never included a physical element, where one could actually touch the virtual world. I dunno, I just like to think about the possibilities, how hypothetical things could work. It is my opinion that it won't be long until virtual-physical reality (as I call it) becomes a reality. And I want to be the one to do it. |
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| Author: | DemonWasp [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
Relatively-realistic rain has been done and isn't hard (it's a particle system, generally). The technical problems with such a system (probably) lie in mobility (how do you limit someone physically walking in a room to a smaller / differently-shaped space, and how do you handle the force-feedback of that) and power (such a suit would consume lots of energy and need to be strong to provide correct force-feedback). The larger problem would be that videogames aren't made to be realistic (with the rare exception found in military simulations), they're made to be fun. They're not real for a reason. You can jump higher, run faster, shoot more accurately, hear better, see better and survive multiple gunshot wounds because realism isn't as fun or exciting as an escapist world where you have the super-human powers you've always wanted (fulfillment of a fantasy). To explore this, start with defining exactly what you want out of the system. When a player jumps onto a virtual platform, what happens physically? When a player is hit by something entirely virtual (bullets, arrows, swords, laser blasts, rockets, the Moon), what happens? What safety mechanisms will these "suits" provide (they need to be able to handle you tripping and falling, plus potentially impacts from other users - people do run into each other); in particular, how is force-feedback handled? You should also probably learn a little more about the human system. For example, placing a 1"x1" screen right over the eye is rather uncomfortable for most people and wouldn't let our eyes focus properly; they'd need to be at least a few inches distant and substantially larger - on the order of 6" from our eyes and covering our entire field-of-view, probably. There are also lots of problems with running on a surface you're not able to see directly, for example. |
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| Author: | Insectoid [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
Collisions with things would be perfect, because the player is actually running into them. This 'suit' would merely be cloth with maybe a small pack on the back, with wires running up and down the limbs to the sensors. If you trip and fall, you're going to fall just as if you'd tripped in reality (because you DID trip). Bullets/lasers and whatnot I haven't quite figured out yet (not hard to animate, hard to do physically). Thought about a paint-ball type of system although it would be a safety hazard and too slow for lasers. Only small, insignificant things would be completely virtual (blowing leaves, for instance). I see what you mean about the goggles and screen size, I didn't know what the human eye could handle. I suppose the field of view could be shrunken by having the edges of the goggles visible (no sense trying to hide that you're wearing goggles, you'll feel them. Might as well make them part of the illusion). Sure, maybe you won't see the actual floor that you're walking on, but you'll think that the floor you see IS the real floor. Now I'm not sure if your brain would be confused but I think it would be fine (though I've been wrong before, especially on things I know next to nothing about). But looking down, you'd see an animated floor of exactly the dimensions of the actual floor. I don't see a problem. Boundaries could be marked by an actual, visible wall. You'll bump right into it. you'll see a wall, you can't climb over it, but beyond it you see a forest, or an extension of the city. I don't know where force feedback comes into this, you are ACTUALLY hitting ACTUAL objects that ACTUALLY exist - they just look different. |
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| Author: | SNIPERDUDE [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 5:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
You forgot about your own walking. A room would limit the space you can move in. These expensive virtual reality systems do exist in part, as seen here: http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/gadgets/other-gadgets/virtual-reality1.htm A "hamster ball" would allow the players to walk around limitlessly. As possible solution for "touching" in-game objects would be to have your gloves have a load of tiny actuators, if you will, that press on the hand (in the coorisponding aeas) with the appropriate pressure. With the recent advent and popularity of 1080p HD, creating virtual worlds that look realistic is possible, especially if you have a dedicated machine to handle the graphics (think of a super PS3). You are right in noting the technology is here, but only the military by the looks of it are willing to spend such a budget, and DARPA seems occupied with other fantasy-like innovations (controlling lightning comes to mind). |
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| Author: | Insectoid [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 5:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
I've seen that hamster ball on Daily Planet, and I don't think it does justice. You won't get the sensation of acceleration, you can't really jump and roll around, there are no real objects to touch. Small actuators in the hand would be a very small improvement, as you'd still not be able to lean on anything, and everything would feel spongy (I think) because your fingers may very well be stronger than the actuators. A large enough room (think hangar-size) would be perfectly fine for all but the most epic of simulations. |
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| Author: | SNIPERDUDE [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
Wouldn't that require some serious organization between real-life blocks and simulated objects? What I'm saying is the actuator technology would be a start, if we put some money into development of the actuators we could have hi-fidelity nano pressure systems that could mimic it on a realistic scale. Combine this with the hangar and the actuators would help simulate some smaller objects or objects that wouldn't fit with the "blue screen blocks" in the room. EDIT: I should probably mention the "actuator gloves" would not only control the touching sensation, but also limit joint movement when needed at the appropraite times. An example if you want to picture is squeezing a tennis ball, the gloves would lock the joint from moving downward at each knuckle to form your hand in a ball shape. The technology for this would be amazing, you could even ignore using a "block" for guns. This would be ideal too, as you could drop and pick up different guns (with different shapes). |
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| Author: | Insectoid [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
For guns I imagine many 'shells' being made that are nothing more than trigger sensor and a pretty shape. 'actuator gloves' might be good for small objects but large ones would benefit from actually existing, as it's far easier to create a texture in reality than digitally (how often do you see 3D texture in video games? Far more often than not it's just drawn to look 3d, but actually is the same from every angle). |
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| Author: | SNIPERDUDE [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
I believe if we had these gloves we could even omit gun props. Although there is is still a need for large bluescreen blocks. And for reference: You can achieve "3D" textures, it's quite common of video games now (although this is for a small-scale pseudo-3D effect to give angled-viewed realism). http://www.computerhope.com/jargon/b/bumpmapp.htm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmpyHc6hXc4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssWn-GSKW74 |
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| Author: | USEC_OFFICER [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
Animator gloves? Didn't Nitendo, Nitendeo, however it's spelt already do that? (The answers are: It's a retorital question, Still have no idea, and yes.) |
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| Author: | DemonWasp [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
There's also the weight / inertia of a handled object to consider - weightless objects are kind of VR-breaking. This would need to be part of the hypothetical force-feedback suit. Existing research into motion capture should be at the point of real-time skeletal animation either now or very soon. The problem of having textures is another important one, unless every game you play has gloves that always feel suspiciously like your suit's actual gloves. Smell is another important factor in realism that would be heavily absent in such a game - it's impossible (and likely undesirable) to mimic the actual scents of a battle or whatever, but some nod in that direction might be in order, depending on the VR being conducted. |
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| Author: | Insectoid [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
Hmm, I didn't think about smell. Meh, eventually there will be a way to do that. |
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| Author: | SNIPERDUDE [ Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Feasability- Virtual-Physical Reality |
For picking up virtual weights, I imagine some sort of nanogears system in the shoulder joint working against the players arms to an appropriate degree. Smells would certainly be a challenge even I couldn't think of how to mimic. |
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