Computer Science Canada

Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
Author:  Dusk Eagle [ Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
I am a Grade 11 student that hopes to attend Waterloo for Computer Science in two years. Recently, I found out from my high school that both my Computer Science course and Computer Engineering course have been canceled for the following year. This really sucks for me as I am generally a high-80s/low 90s student, but get 93-100% in these two courses over a semester. I am currently contemplating two options:
a) Taking Computer Science online and forgetting about Computer Engineering for the year.
b) Transferring schools.

The problem with option b is that other schools in my area also have canceled these two courses. Finding a school offering them could be a bit of a challenge, and there's no guarantee I'll get the three maths/two sciences I want for Grade 12 if I transfer (I am acquiring my Grade 12 English credit this semester, while in Grade 11, so no need to worry about that). Another problem with this option is figuring out a way to transport myself from home to school to and back everyday. Does anyone know how much it costs for busing to schools outside of your area in York Region?

What I really want to know is, what is the better option to take here?
Author:  Euphoracle [ Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:20 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
So did mine. It wasn't very useful anyway, though the comp eng one was. Too bad I missed that one. Don't worry about Gr. 12 compsci, they reteach everything first year, and if you want to skip that intro course, you need more than Ontario's curriculum covers...
Author:  mono-1-rulz [ Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
Wow...thats really bad luck......
Well first off, I would like to tell you that the Grd11 and 12 Computer Science courses are NOT MANDATORY to get into the computer science program.
The main courses are i think : Advanced Function, Calculus, English, and one other Grd 12 U course
Yes, they do help your case.......but you can do without them.........
So i would advise you to stay where you are and concentrate on these courses.

But if you still want to do the course, maybe you can do the AP course instead. I think they let you do it by independent study......and its much better than to waste so much time trying to get to school and back.

Hope that helped! Very Happy Wink
Author:  Tony [ Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:38 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
high school computer science is, in fact, not a required course for admissions. Unless you have an exceptional teacher, most end up learning the bulk of what they do, via their own efforts.

You mind find http://compsci.ca/blog/the-disadvantages-of-high-school-programming/ of interest; sometimes too much high school programming puts students at a disadvantage.

I'm with mono-1-rulz on this one: go for independent study, and see if your school is willing to give you a credit for that. I've done AP material on my own. You might have to take this up the administrative ladder, but ultimately they just need to supervise you while you fill out the exam that will be mailed to school.
Author:  Dusk Eagle [ Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
Thanks for your replies so far.

You've told me about CompSci, now what about Computer Engineering? With Computer Science, I basically knew everything they were teaching, but with Engineering, I was learning tons of useful information I didn't know. I checked http://www.collegeboard.com/student/testing/ap/subjects.html and there doesn't seem to be a Computer Engineering course, so is there any website that teaches this information at a good pace, even if it's not for a credit?

Edit: Oh and Tony, in regards to
Tony wrote:
high school computer science is, in fact, not a required course for admissions. Unless you have an exceptional teacher, most end up learning the bulk of what they do, via their own efforts.

this is what I have been doing, but I figured it looked better to have a computer science credit, and taking the course helped significantly raise my grade average.
Author:  Prabhakar Ragde [ Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
Tony @ Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:38 pm wrote:

You mind find http://compsci.ca/blog/the-disadvantages-of-high-school-programming/ of interest; sometimes too much high school programming puts students at a disadvantage.


By coincidence, the author of that blog post just finished writing my final exam.

To the OP: I would suggest just doing self-study in CS, and for CE, see if you can get some of the materials that would have been used in the grade 12 course to work through. Make it clear to your teacher that you're not asking for credit and that you won't be bugging him about it. If your teacher then offers to see if you can get an independent study credit and/or come to them for extra help, that's gravy.
Author:  SJ [ Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:41 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
I agree with PR. I learnt more in the summer doing usaco, topcoder, and personal projects than I did in both gr 11 and 12 comp sci.
Author:  Analysis Mode [ Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
All the materials you need are online. SPOJ, Topcoder SRM's, Topcoder Algorithm Tutorials, USACO, Uva, cplusplus.com for C++ users. You should also get yourself Sedgewick's Algorithms.
Author:  Dark [ Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:23 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
For Ontario students ICS4M becomes ISC4U and ICS4C nexy year Razz

Luckily there was barely enough people for ICS4M this year

sucks for you though
Author:  saltpro15 [ Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:28 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
our ICS3U and 4U's may get put together, there's not enough people for 2 classes
Author:  Analysis Mode [ Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
yeah the ontario curriculum's been radically changed..again.
Author:  Prabhakar Ragde [ Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:21 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
Is there a description of said changes anywhere?
Author:  Prabhakar Ragde [ Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:26 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
Hmm, found one on the TDCSB web page.

"This course enables students to further develop knowledge and skills in computer science. Students will use modular design principles
to create complex and fully documented programs, according to industry standards. Student teams will manage a large software
development project, from planning through to project review. Students will also analyse algorithms for effectiveness. They will
investigate ethical issues in computing and further explore environmental issues, emerging technologies, areas of research in computer
science, and careers in the field."

We don't manage most of that in our undergraduate degree, and almost none of that in our two first-year courses.
Author:  SJ [ Thu Apr 16, 2009 7:56 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
we covered all of that mentioned on the TDCSB page (in ics4m), but most things, with the exception of data structures, was so shallow it couldnt have been used for anything practical.

also, i find the short spread of cs in ontario high schools disturbing.
Author:  Prabhakar Ragde [ Thu Apr 16, 2009 4:39 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
Can you clarify your "short spread" comment?
Author:  SJ [ Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:04 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
i find cs in high school a great introduction to the subject. it is both fun and challenging, and it's not one of those non-core courses people take because "they are easy and you get good marks for doing nothing." as some people said above, their cs courses are either canceled or merged because not enough people are taking it. that doesn't have to be the case. i think it's just that cs is not well advertised to students, and potentially great cs students never even try the course. that's what I mean by "short spread." many students in my school look upon cs as one of those distant courses, and i think it should at least be on the same level of popularity as, say, accounting.

i just read what i wrote earlier. i don't mean "short spread" as in the material covered if thats what you thought.. it's pretty good compared to other high school courses.
Author:  BigBear [ Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:25 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
My school just changed the M level course for grade 11 and 12 to U and C but my school is only offering the U level.

Also you should see if you can take it as an online course
Author:  Prabhakar Ragde [ Thu Apr 16, 2009 6:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: RE:Grade 12 CompSci and CompEng cancelled for next year.
SJ @ Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:04 pm wrote:
i think it's just that cs is not well advertised to students, and potentially great cs students never even try the course. that's what I mean by "short spread." many students in my school look upon cs as one of those distant courses, and i think it should at least be on the same level of popularity as, say, accounting.


Yes, I agree. We have the same problem at the university level. Though it does depend on good teachers. A bad teacher can make a hash of anything, but if it's accounting, at least people stick with it, even if it's for the wrong reasons.

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