Computer Science Canada

Living off bytes .... I wonder
Author:  darkangel [ Tue May 06, 2008 7:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Living off bytes .... I wonder
In the back of my head ever since i started my life as a programmer, i have always wanted to make a life simulator. But i always shoved it aside.
This urge has now started eating away at my brain and is now forcing me to begin creating it. Yet one problem stands in my way, what should my life simulator keep track of?
Then i thought that maybe the many people of CompSci might be able to assist me?.

what i have in my life simulator as of now is;

lifeRemaining -how long till it dies
lifeLived -how long its lived from when it was born
social -its sociability (the higher it is the more "people" will be attracted to that person)
intelligence -how smart it is (will effect social and if, when, and how they "level up")
gender -M or F
level -its current "level" at which it is living (could be a scholar, business man, hobo, samerai, whatever...)

I would life to stay away from "hunger" and things like that, im assuming that my people will be able to sustain themselves with food. But if it calls for it i will put it in.
But other than that what else could i add? And how should it work? Should the people be controlled by the user? or is it all done automatically? or does the user "suggest" where the person should go and the person decides for himself? I don't know.

What are you suggestions...
Author:  Tony [ Tue May 06, 2008 7:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Living off bytes .... I wonder
darkangel @ Tue May 06, 2008 7:26 pm wrote:

lifeRemaining -how long till it dies

seems kind of unrealistic to have the lifespan be predeterminate at the spawn. Since you are "simulating" a system, it would be more accurate to have a very tiny chance of "sudden death" event, so that you get a nice normal distribution over the population.

As an added benefit, you could alter that value as a result of other "custom events" -- increase the probability of sudden death during sickness, from exposure to radiation, or obtaining a "hobo" "level".
Author:  btiffin [ Tue May 06, 2008 7:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Living off bytes .... I wonder
Check out the old school Populous and just about any of the Sims games.

One is hands off the individual, one is very hands on. Those would be the two extremes I know of and may give you some hints. Oh and of course, check out Conway's game of Life.

Cheers
Author:  Asherel [ Tue May 06, 2008 8:29 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
I'm working on a Life Simulator, project of someone elses. I'm willing to work with you if you wish, I've got quite a bit done, and have an example I can PM you.

It's going to be tough, but with the right plans it can be executed effectively.

Let me know your decision.
Author:  darkangel [ Tue May 06, 2008 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Living off bytes .... I wonder
Asherel wrote:

I'm working on a Life Simulator, project of someone elses. I'm willing to work with you if you wish, I've got quite a bit done, and have an example I can PM you.

It's going to be tough, but with the right plans it can be executed effectively.

Let me know your decision.

ya i'd love that.

btiffin wrote:

Check out the old school Populous and just about any of the Sims games.

One is hands off the individual, one is very hands on. Those would be the two extremes I know of and may give you some hints. Oh and of course, check out Conway's game of Life.

Cheers


will do.

Tony wrote:

darkangel @ Tue May 06, 2008 7:26 pm wrote:

lifeRemaining -how long till it dies

seems kind of unrealistic to have the lifespan be predeterminate at the spawn. Since you are "simulating" a system, it would be more accurate to have a very tiny chance of "sudden death" event, so that you get a nice normal distribution over the population.

As an added benefit, you could alter that value as a result of other "custom events" -- increase the probability of sudden death during sickness, from exposure to radiation, or obtaining a "hobo" "level".

The main reason why i had a predetermined life is i figured it would be easier and less laggy than every turn doing calculations to see if they died of a heart attack every "turn". Plus don't you believe in fate Smile
Author:  Tony [ Tue May 06, 2008 9:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Living off bytes .... I wonder
darkangel @ Tue May 06, 2008 9:35 pm wrote:
don't you believe in fate Smile

Absolutely not Wink

And besides, every turn you'd have to check current time against the end time, to see if a character expires. It wouldn't be any more complicated to roll a die instead.
Author:  Clayton [ Tue May 06, 2008 10:06 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
Tony wrote:
It wouldn't be any more complicated to roll a die instead.


Hehe, "die" in this context makes me laugh. Other than that, I fully agree with Tony's idea, plus, it makes it so you don't have to force some characters to die when you want them to. Also, it lets you stay open for other things depending on how complex you want to get by making "seriously ill" or "coma" statuses as well, instead of "alive" or "dead".
Author:  darkangel [ Tue May 06, 2008 10:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
Clayton @ Tue May 06, 2008 10:06 pm wrote:

plus, it makes it so you don't have to force some characters to die when you want them to. Also, it lets you stay open for other things depending on how complex you want to get by making "seriously ill" or "coma" statuses as well, instead of "alive" or "dead".

True, i don't want to limit myself onto what i can or cannot do. So i'll throw that in. I'm starting to make the class that will hold all this data, this is great didn't expect the speed of response.
Author:  Dan [ Wed May 07, 2008 12:15 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
I think it whould be rather cool to use tony's rolling for death system but use realstic problilitys of death by diffrent casues if you can find them and also add in realstic increases to the odds from doing diffrent activitys from studys that have been done.

Like incrases the likey hood of canser if they smoke and have realstic odds of surviing lung cancer.

Maybe thats a bit much but would be cool.
Author:  petree08 [ Wed May 07, 2008 8:06 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
it would be neat if this could be turned into some sort of game where you could have some control over characters and environment (maybe not to the extent as the sims). Like letting the player "play god" by starting plagues and natural disasters. Also the player could "bless" the characters with good fortune and health. Could be neat. Also a ranking system of goddlyness would be sweet (like sadistic, cruel, passive, blesser, ect)

sorry for the large post, but this life sim thing gets me excited
Author:  darkangel [ Wed May 07, 2008 8:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
petree08 @ Wed May 07, 2008 8:06 am wrote:
it would be neat if this could be turned into some sort of game where you could have some control over characters and environment (maybe not to the extent as the sims). Like letting the player "play god" by starting plagues and natural disasters. Also the player could "bless" the characters with good fortune and health. Could be neat. Also a ranking system of goddlyness would be sweet (like sadistic, cruel, passive, blesser, ect)

sorry for the large post, but this life sim thing gets me excited


Actually this is exactly what i was hoping to make.
Author:  Aziz [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:04 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
lolnoob, lol noob. He's trying to make his own sim, and not play a game. Sims has been mentioned several times here. Please read before you post =/

darkangel, are you planning on this being a game, or a simulation. The difference being, a game where a player controls a character(s), or a simulation where the program runs in the background and AI takes care of everything. You can mix the two by having a life-engine sim, and allowing the user to execute commands, like "increase fertility at (50, 100), a range of 5km".

There could be some interesting algorithms. You'll have to define these first before you go on making the system. And I'd start with text based before doing any graphics. Some things to consider:

- Reproduction system, babies born per turn = some operation on the ratio of M to F and a random encounter, perhaps taking in "fertility" values of individuals if you keep track of that, or nearby factors, such as a monument to the fertility god, or (heh) a sex shop.
- Aging algorithms
- Expansion, if you're planning on incorporating geographical features like location


It'd be interesting to see what you can do with resources. If you can incorporate some sort of resource like food, money, shelter, w/e you can make a sulf-sustaining system.

I think I've gone a bit off of your track there though. I all depends on what type of scale you're doing things at. It kind of sounds like you want to do a system of a few individuals rather that a society.

I think I just gave myself a good idea!
Author:  Aziz [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 11:09 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
http://www.math.com/students/wonders/life/life.html

Life is a simpler version of what I described.
Author:  SNIPERDUDE [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
I can make a list of various attributes and variables (classes ideas) to help out. I've always wanted to create a more realistic sim for a while; it'd be cool if I can contribute any.

Let me know Wink
Author:  Zeroth [ Thu Jun 19, 2008 4:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Living off bytes .... I wonder
I'd be interested in seeing what kind of theoretical conclusions can be made from a life sim game like this, similar to the Game of Life. A few interesting facts about Conway's Game of Life, is that it is Turing Complete(the theoretical form, not the language, where the Game can effectively simulate any computer, and any computer or language that is turing complete can simulate it. ). I'd love to see if there are any emergent properties in a game based on attractions, rate of breeding(effectively a simple genetic algorithm), plus death by exertion Wink (Admit it, you were thinking it!).
Author:  SNIPERDUDE [ Sat Jun 21, 2008 8:10 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
well, looks like resources like wiki, stats Canada, and biology are going to be good places to find this type of stuff out.
Author:  MrAndrews [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:09 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
so far, this sounds like a very large and complex program . . . personally i would start out with something simulating the life of very basic organisms (microbes in a pond) and go from there . . . maybe see if you could introduce evolution . . . anyway this sounds like an awesome program
Author:  SNIPERDUDE [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:50 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
yes, and would be best for a team (me? lol) to break it down. Seems too much for one persone alone.

But this would actually be a great project for us to work on as a group; just brainstorming for the moment.
Author:  MrAndrews [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:59 pm ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
wow, way to steal Darkangel's project.

Just kidding. Actually, if Darkangel doesnt mind, I would love to try and help with this.
Author:  SNIPERDUDE [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 6:47 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
not stealing, volunteering.
Author:  Aziz [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:12 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
Razz Zeroth, I'm working on something like what you described. PM me or meet me in IRC and I'll show you what I've got. It's in Python, and will eventually get a pygame interface, so yay!
Author:  SNIPERDUDE [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:00 am ]
Post subject:  RE:Living off bytes .... I wonder
I'm guessing this is going to be mad in turing,
so I can finish up and submit my GUI class here

There is a screenshot there ot that style, plus I have more.

I am almost done it! I hope...
I at least can submit the button GUI part...

Anywho, yea, I can help out with interface for this...

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