Computer Science Canada Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
| Author: | Mr. Gruntsworthy [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Currently I am working on a Game Design Document for a very interesting game. It's basically a sprite version of Super Smash Brothers. In Essence, the goal is to have 50 playable characters (I already have the sprite sheets), at least 30 levels, p2p online multiplayer (as well, if i can i'm going to write a dedicated server app), and single player. You may or may not have played Super Smash Flash on newgrounds.com or a similar site. That game was done in Flash. The game I'm talking about is going to be built from the ground up, and is going to be slightly more complex than that flash version (as well, it's going to have a more 'mature' feel to it). This is a SERIOUS project consideration and is going to be permanently added to my portfolio. This game project is going to be our game group Randomation's break out into the games industry. Of course, this game must and will be freeware due to the fact that we have no rights whatsoever on any of the characters to be used. If anyone is interested, that's what this thread is for, to give you a little light information on the whole project. I already have some people who are interested, and I'm looking for more, specifically programmers (as i'm just learning C++ and I'm not that knowledgeable in this field yet). The specific types of people (in ranking order) we're looking for are: 1)C++ programmers 2)Audio composer (preferrably techno style) 3)advertisers/marketers (for advertising the game around once the project is underway) Now, let me clearly state again: This is a SERIOUS project of mine, and is no laughing matter. Those who are involved in the project will be given deadlines (relatively loose at first, but will become more defined as the project develops). Those involved will also recieve a complete copy of the game design document, and are expected to post on/check the Randomations forums once a day. As well, due to the fact that this is a freeware game, and that neither me nor any other member of Randomations has any money to spare, this game will be a non profit game. Those who reply to this thread, do not make posts that negatively impacts or otherwise inuslts Randomations and it's project. This thread is for those interested, and you are not one of those people, I ask you to kindly leave so you can continue perusing the forums and not have to waste your time and mine by needlessly posting comments that aren't directly related to what this thread's asking. Thank you for your time, and I hope I get some replies. |
|
| Author: | Mazer [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 1:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
You may take this as a negative comment, but it isn't and it's worth saying regardless of what you think. Releasing the game of freeware doesn't mean that you're allowed to use work that belongs to other people without getting their permission. You'll need to either get permission from the owner(s) or make your own. You say that this is a serious project, and that you'll be using it for your portfolio. Why not look into recruiting some artists to help? 2D sprites shouldn't be so bad, and CS students aren't the only ones who like the idea of making games. Another idea is to see if there's a gamedev group or igda chapter where you live. You may be able to learn alot from them. Lastly, can I just ask how old you are? I don't mean to sound like a dick and say that kids don't have the skills to make a game, I just want to get an idea of how much time you and your friends will be able to devote to the project along with school and stuff. |
|
| Author: | Mr. Gruntsworthy [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
I am 17 years of age, soon to be 18. I will be starting college (hopefully) this september, so my schedule will be fairly busy, but not enough to stop me from dedicating some time to working on this game. Your points are duly noted; however to your one point I must reply: As long as the credit is given to the proper companies, and the owners of the respective rights declared, i don't think the game will violate any laws; unless you're talking about the sprites being rips. I will have to look into that. Besides, as freeware, it is free to distribute without cost, therefore not violating any copyright laws. |
|
| Author: | Andy [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
maybe you should actually look into copyright laws. |
|
| Author: | bugzpodder [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
not to mention that 99% of such projects end in failure. |
|
| Author: | rdrake [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Mr. Gruntsworthy @ Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:11 pm wrote: Your points are duly noted; however to your one point I must reply: As long as the credit is given to the proper companies, and the owners of the respective rights declared, i don't think the game will violate any laws; unless you're talking about the sprites being rips. I will have to look into that. To be honest, the main reason why you ever see copyright notices on a product from companies other than that which produced said product is because they licensed something from other companies. You may not be selling the game, but you still do not own the property. It's like using somebody's belongings for your own use without permission, it's called stealing. It does not matter if you are charging them to use it or not.
Mr. Gruntsworthy @ Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:11 pm wrote: Besides, as freeware, it is free to distribute without cost, therefore not violating any copyright laws. That means absolutely nothing, other than the fact that you made no money for them to come after. They may still decided to sue you anyways.
Creating something similar may or may not be legal, depending on how you do it. Using the same names and very similar or identical characters is just asking for a takedown notice. |
|
| Author: | md [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Copyright infringement != stealing. However that doesn't make it good either. I too think you might want to try something simpler; as I deem your chances of success to be ~ 0.01% |
|
| Author: | Mr. Gruntsworthy [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 5:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Alright, then explain something. Halo Zero, a 2-D halo game made by a game design group in France that's far more known than my Randomations. They never got permission from Bungie. The super smash flash game that came out. Same deal. I see games and stuff based on these Intellectual Properties all the time. Mine will be no different, other than it will be alot more detailed, thought out, and complex. |
|
| Author: | md [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 5:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Just because others break the law doesn't mean you can. In fact since you are so pro-breaking copyright law if I ever suspect that you have used any of my code in this game of yours I will sue the pants off you for copyright infringement. |
|
| Author: | ericfourfour [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 9:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Let's just relax. Mr. Gruntsworthy if you change your artwork I think everyone will stop complaining. |
|
| Author: | Clayton [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 9:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
ericfourfour: md brings up a good point, if anyone found out that their code/artwork has been stolen/used without their permission (especially if said work is from a big company), Mr.Gruntsworthy should expect to be getting some very serious phone calls. |
|
| Author: | Mazer [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 9:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | RE:Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
My issue with that artwork is that you're distributing something that somebody else made. It doesn't matter if you aren't charging, you need their permission (did they give it to the public domain, license it as GPL or CC?). No, they may not bother to sue you. In many cases, it isn't worth their time to hunt down small groups. At most, companies tend to just send cease and desist letters. That's if they even notice you. BUT, you want to take this seriously, so don't discredit your hard work by tossing in graphics that mean nothing to you. It can be done. It'll be hard as hell, harder than you think (seriously, I have been [and still am] in the same boat), but keep at it. Read everything you can find, and make sure you learn what you need to know properly before trying to jump into making a game. Good luck with everything. |
|
| Author: | Mr. Gruntsworthy [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 9:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Halo zero contains custom sprites; it is a perfectly legal game. as well, the super smash flash breaks no laws. Prove me wrong. It's not a flame, just I want to be sure that what you say is true. I want supporting evidence. If making custom sprites is the solution, then I'm also going to be looking for custom spriters. and as far as the code goes, i'll only use what people write specifically for the game--not something that someone else has written. and, sorry to say, unless your code is part of a patented program, or otherwise legally protected by you, it is just code that can be used at will. That is not, however, to say that I would do such a thing--if i need code, I will ask for permission. I am still doing this project regardless. |
|
| Author: | Mazer [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 10:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Mr. Gruntsworthy @ Thu Feb 08, 2007 9:50 pm wrote: and, sorry to say, unless your code is part of a patented program, or otherwise legally protected by you, it is just code that can be used at will.
Any code you (or I) write is protected. |
|
| Author: | apomb [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Mr. Gruntsworthy wrote: Halo zero contains custom sprites; it is a perfectly legal game. as well, the super smash flash breaks no laws. Prove me wrong. It's not a flame, just I want to be sure that what you say is true. I want supporting evidence. If making custom sprites is the solution, then I'm also going to be looking for custom spriters. and as far as the code goes, i'll only use what people write specifically for the game--not something that someone else has written. and, sorry to say, unless your code is part of a patented program, or otherwise legally protected by you, it is just code that can be used at will. That is not, however, to say that I would do such a thing--if i need code, I will ask for permission. I am still doing this project regardless. If it is US that you are worried about not being "serious" about your plan, i think you should rethink your Professionalism in the matter. Code is a big deal to many companies, and even individuals. you cant just "ask permission" to use code, it doesnt exactly work that way. Now, if you were to ask for a concerted effort to help with the coding of your game, then by all means, go ahead. But what it sounds like you're planning is to use other people's already made programs, pick them apart and make them into a clusterfuck of a program that you're going to pass off as your own. Not something ANYONE will be happy with. |
|
| Author: | Mr. Gruntsworthy [ Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
You've got me wrong. I said 'if' i needed code; im planning on having the game completely written by programmers specifically for this game. I don't think i'll need to use other people's code unless absolutely necessary, which I hope it won't be. All of you (except for Mazer) seem to be getting the wrong impression. I'm sorry if this comes off a little unprofessional, but hey, I was blunt, factual about my goals, and straight to the point. If you are interested, fine; if not, its up to you if you want to keep repeating the same things over and over again and wasting time. It's not that I am being deaf to your points; i view some of them as valid; however if you have something to say about the legality of this project please PM me as this thread is meant only for those interested; and I fear that by reading your posts those who are interested may be shyed away. |
|
| Author: | zylum [ Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
May I ask what you are bringing to the table? How will you contribute to the team? |
|
| Author: | bugzpodder [ Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Quote: Halo zero contains custom sprites; it is a perfectly legal game. as well, the super smash flash breaks no laws.
Says who? you? There is a fair use clause in copyright infrigement, and this certainly violates that. Quote: and, sorry to say, unless your code is part of a patented program, or otherwise legally protected by you, it is just code that can be used at will. Again, same as above. Its someone else's intellectual property. Think of it this way. Someone wrote an essay and made it publically available on the net. While it is not part of a "copyrighted book" or is "legally protected", use parts of their essay as your own is plain and simple plagerism. If you are in college and you caught doing that, you will be given a warning and a penalty on the assignment (coding/essay, whateveR). A second time offender will surely be kicked out. |
|
| Author: | Mr. Gruntsworthy [ Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Halo zero is well known by Bungie and Bungie has not spoke of ANY illegalities of the game. And it IS a fan-made game. And I see that you've yet to show a point proving that it is an illegal game. Please, I stress PLEASE, PM me if you have a problem with this game. DO NOT post it here. The same thing gets repeated over and over again. Now, if you cannot follow such a simple request, why should I bother listening to you? Please, only post if you're interested in the project. And, to answer the question of what I would bring to the 'table,' here is what i would be doing: The most important thing would be that I am designing the game, right down to the finer points. Also, I will be spearheading the project, watching over the coding assembly and the game's structurization. As well, I would be coding parts of it (Or, as time progresses, the majority of it as my knowledge increases). So far, only Mazer has shown the politeness that deserves respect. The majority of you however seem to be coming off a bit rude. |
|
| Author: | Hikaru79 [ Fri Feb 09, 2007 3:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
Again, you shouldn't see anyone here as rude; we're trying to help you. Your case is not without precedent, and it HAS turned out ugly before. You seem to like examples. Okay. Let's show an example: http://www.gamesfirst.com/?id=1418 -- Halogen. A Halo-based mod. To quote, Quote: Hours ago, we finally received the words we've been dreading since the mod started to get noticed. Microsoft has decided that we are infringing on the intellectual property of Bungie Studios and has asked us to stop development on Halogen.
The fact that you found one case where legal action was NOT taken means nothing. It could be for a lot of reasons; maybe Microsoft doesn't want to risk the bad PR. Maybe the project you listed is just flying way under the radar (not popular enough yet). Either way, playing with other companies' intellectual property is a dead end. Either you're not succesful, in which case, what was the point? Or you are succesful, and you get noticed and shut down. It can't end prettily for you. There are exceptions for things like parodies, but your game doesn't sound like a parody; it sounds like a 2-D PC port more than anything else. Of course, they can't copyright the *idea* behind the game (not yet, anyway), so as others have suggested, go ahead and make the same game but with different sprites. I'm sure there'd be a HUGE market for an online version of Smash Bros, judging by how popular it is here in my University residence. But using the actual Nintendo characters is just playing with fire... My two cents. |
|
| Author: | Mr. Gruntsworthy [ Tue Feb 20, 2007 8:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
well, I take it that no one's interested, so i consider this topic a failure. by the way, nice point. Though, i've never heard of Halogen. But, then again, that's probably exactly why... |
|
| Author: | apomb [ Wed Feb 21, 2007 11:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Randomations Game Project. A serious project, looking for those interested |
awwe, are all your dreams crushed? well at least you didnt get humiliated, right? right? |
|