Computer Science Canada I was just wondering |
| Author: | Ninja [ Tue May 30, 2006 6:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | I was just wondering |
Hello everybody. I was just wondering today about CPU temperature. The problem is that the air conditioner at my house is broken and until we buy a new unit, im using one of those standup fans to keep myself from dying in the heat in my room. What i wanted to ask is that my CPU gets really hot cause of no cool air, and the fan always spins at the highest speed. I do turn my pc off when i go to sleep at night to let it cool, but when im home its always on cause i have lots of work to do on here. So is the heatsink going to be fine with this fan until i get an air conditioner? |
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| Author: | Cervantes [ Tue May 30, 2006 7:08 pm ] |
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I'd turn it off just to be safe. 
Power consumption has reached a record for this day, I believe. Let's conserve power, people! My computer is on, but only because I really need it now to work on my CS FP. I can make up for that by not having an air conditioner, though. |
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| Author: | md [ Tue May 30, 2006 8:18 pm ] |
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I don't have an air conditioner; therefor I see nothing wrong with keeping my computers on 
Your processor should be fine so long as your fan doesn't die. If you can't hear your fan any more then something is wrong. |
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| Author: | Ninja [ Tue May 30, 2006 8:22 pm ] |
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ah i see. Ya my fan is working fine, just running as fast as it can. Before i used to leave my pc running 24/7 cause i used to host some vent and game servers but now we got all rented to i guess i dont need it on 24/7 now. I do turn it off when i go to sleep and the whole day next day, its only on from 5 pm to 11 pm, 6 hours i guess it should be fine eh? Thanx for the help guys, now im sure my pc wont blow up  |
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| Author: | Dan [ Tue May 30, 2006 8:39 pm ] |
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If your BIOS is made right then it should turn off the computer long before it is at dangures levels and not let you reboot intill the temp is in the sage range. As for turing your computer off, it will decress the life of your computer with each reboot. So weather it is better off turing it off is debateble for a few reasons: 1. It uses up more life time of the computer and as such leades to more computer wast witch is aucatly exteramly bad for the enverment since alot of the computens of a computer are toxic to the enverment and hard to recely. 2. Boot up a computer use signifactly more power then running it noramly. This means if you reboot alot you could aucatly be using up more power then just leaving it on. 3. Compared to other home aplicantes and elections a computer takes up a very minumal amount of power. If you whont to save the everment try turing thos off 1st and puting your computer on a power save mode. I whould deftaly recomend turing off monters of every kind tho, my bet is they take up just as much power and with some types leaving them on hurts more then restarting life time wise. If you are consired about the enverment i think there alot of issues that need to be adressed before you start complaining about computers :p Also if you have a standered monther borad there are alot of aplication witch can monder the tempcher of your cpu and if your fan is working and then do things acordingly if they stop working or start overheating. |
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| Author: | Ninja [ Tue May 30, 2006 9:12 pm ] |
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ya, my friend told me that too, that if u keep rebooting the pc its life goes down on each reboot and it takes up more engergy, thats y ive been leaving it on 24/7 since last september, in the winter it never overheated obviously but now the heatsink is REALLY hot, like i cant touch it for more then 5-10 seconds, i was just concerned about it lol. i dont wanna wake up one night and have to call 911 cause my pc is on fire lol. i think last year once my pc restarted and wont turn back on for 5 mins so i guess my BIOS is setup right as long as temperature detection goes. So i guess its not a big deal eh |
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| Author: | md [ Tue May 30, 2006 9:29 pm ] |
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rebooting PCs does not decrease their life spans, at least not in a measurable amount. It's just a myth these days, though it used to be true. Your computer also doesn't use noticably more power on rebooting; especially compared to how much it uses if you ust leave it on. Again, an old truth that is now just a myth. Generally speaking your heat sync is supposed to be hot; that means it's getting hte heat away from the processor. if you can find an infra-red thermometer to measure the heatsync temp (or use built in sensors to get the CPU temperature) and it's not over 65 degrees you should be fine. |
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| Author: | Dan [ Wed May 31, 2006 4:18 am ] |
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Cornflake wrote: rebooting PCs does not decrease their life spans, at least not in a measurable amount. It's just a myth these days, though it used to be true. Your computer also doesn't use noticably more power on rebooting; especially compared to how much it uses if you ust leave it on. Again, an old truth that is now just a myth.
I disagrea. I know for 100% fact that it is ture with laptops, esptaly with the opening and closing for the screen and i am prity shure the inintal boot causes the hardrive to spin faster and work harder then normal witch increaes the likey hound of the reader to evduntaly touch the disk and permpemently scrach it casuing hard drive failure. In therms of just having enegery go threw the monther bord it probly dose not have a big effect but it is the moviable parts of the computer that have the problems. The normal boot up access all the hdds, the cd-rom, and the floopy or other disk drives witch all have moving parts. The real debate is what is worse, the sureger of use or the prolonged heat from the computer idealing? |
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| Author: | Ninja [ Wed May 31, 2006 8:27 am ] |
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agreed. also i checked my CPU temperature last night after i posted and it was fluctuating between 65-67..so i guess im pretty close to the danger zone, although the system temp was 37 degrees celcius. But that temperature was after i turned the fan in my room off and also there was no wind blowing too, today its clowdy outsite and the temperature is around 22, so im expecting some wind, im probably gonna get my air conditioner today or tomorrow. Do u guys think buying a new, better heatsink and fan would be better? Im just running the one that came in the box for the processor, but its working fine, well atleast for now |
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| Author: | md [ Wed May 31, 2006 10:46 am ] |
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Opening and closing the screen on a laptop will eventually wear out the hinges and the ribon wire that contols the LCD. However those are designed to last until well after the design life of your computer. When booting the only hardship on your computer is the drives spinning up. The only reason that's hard is because it takes more energy to get a stationady platter spinning then to keep one spinning if it already is. The drives don't over rev, they will only spin up to their normal operating speed. Again, this is designed into the drives and will not lead to failure before the end of it's design lifetime. Modern computers are designed to be able to reboot. They use a little bit extra power on boot compared to idling (when you actually use your computer it ends up using more power then it does booting), but if you turn your computer off for an hour instead of leaving it on you will indeed save power. Things do change for servers that must run continuously however. If you leave a computer running with the drives spinning for 3 years then if you do have to restart teh drive might fail to spin up do to age. Given that most hard drive warranties are only 1 year (3 is the far limit) that's not unreasonable; if you leave your car running 24/7 you can be sure it'll break well before it's waranty is up, but a computer is happy to just keep on running for twice or three times the waranty length. As for the heat sync; the box heat sync should keep your processor cool. If your running at %100 CPU usage then it'll be hot, but you should still be fine. It was designed expressly to keep it cool enough not to die. For reference the temperature in my room (where teh computer is) is 30 degrees; inside the case it's 37 degrees, my cpu idling while I write this is at 46, voltage regulators are at 42 and my gpu is at 49. The gpu doesn't even have a fan; though the case has three. |
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| Author: | Ninja [ Wed May 31, 2006 10:50 am ] |
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Ah. Ya i am going to buy a new heatsinc w/fan today just to be on the safe side, ive had this pc for 1.5 years with the same old heatsinc and fan and i think its time to change it now. The temperature in my room is 30 too and system temp around there but my CPU was 65-67, which kinda frightned me, so i was worried about it and i decided to buy a new heatsinc.By the way, are there any ones that you recommend i get? cause i gotta go to the store and order them, they only have the cheap crappy ones on sale on the store so everything u wanna buy thats good, u have to order it. Thanks for the help  . Oh by the way im also thinking of buying a 12 cm case fan too lol  |
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| Author: | Andy [ Wed May 31, 2006 12:50 pm ] |
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seagate has standard 5 year warranty on all new drives |
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| Author: | md [ Wed May 31, 2006 1:05 pm ] |
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Then drives should last even longer! The only drive failure I have heard about because the server was restarted was on a 10 year old server 4 years ago. It had actually been runniong continuously for more then 5 years... but the uptime counter had rolled over at least once so no one is sure how many more. |
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| Author: | codemage [ Wed May 31, 2006 1:14 pm ] |
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If you haven't upgraded anything in your rig or overclocked anything, your stock fan & sink should be fine. Additionally, a new fan is only worthwhile if it's an improvement. (Newer isn't necessarily better). If you have an outside fan running anyway - you might find it helps to point it at the case. Clean out your case if you haven't in a while. Dust contributes considerably to the heat in the system. Make sure there isn't anything obstructing the case; the fan outlet, or air inlets. Finally; if you have your heart set on a new fan - you'll probably be interested in getting one that is quiet. A lot of people overlook this in favour of a fan that just pushes a lot of air. |
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| Author: | wtd [ Wed May 31, 2006 1:36 pm ] |
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Regarding fans... Big and slow is better than small and fast. They move more air, and they're quieter. |
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| Author: | Ninja [ Wed May 31, 2006 3:06 pm ] |
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ya, theres no dust in my case i clean it once every week. my case is open from both sides and the fan is pointing towards it. It helped a bit my temp i just checked is 60-61, but i am getting a new heat sinc today just to be on the safe side, and i never overclocked anything on my pc. I knew that wouldnt be a good idea considering my air conditioner is 8 years old and somehow it was still working last year. Oh well lets see what it turns out like, thanx again for the help guys |
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| Author: | Dan [ Wed May 31, 2006 5:22 pm ] |
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Cornflake wrote: Opening and closing the screen on a laptop will eventually wear out the hinges and the ribon wire that contols the LCD. However those are designed to last until well after the design life of your computer.
You whould think they whould be designed to last the life of your laptop but the life of a laptop acording to dell is under 3 years. Every dell laptop i have had or seen some one have has died this way in under 3 years. Cornflake wrote: When booting the only hardship on your computer is the drives spinning up. The only reason that's hard is because it takes more energy to get a stationady platter spinning then to keep one spinning if it already is. The drives don't over rev, they will only spin up to their normal operating speed. Again, this is designed into the drives and will not lead to failure before the end of it's design lifetime. I know and it dose make it last longer but the problem of it puting force on the head and the drive is still there. It is the going from nothing to noraml speed that puts stress on it. They will not fail as soon as if they did not have this but puting that stress on the drive is hardly making it last longer then not puting the stress on it. Espltay if you have older hard derives. Have you ever fealt some of the hard drivers form a few years ago when they boot up? They vibreate like crazy, so much so you can feal it threw your computer. This is hardly good for them. Cornflake wrote: Modern computers are designed to be able to reboot. They use a little bit extra power on boot compared to idling (when you actually use your computer it ends up using more power then it does booting), but if you turn your computer off for an hour instead of leaving it on you will indeed save power. I did not say you whould not save power, tho using the power saving features instend of rebooting will save you power and computer life time. Cornflake wrote: Things do change for servers that must run continuously however. If you leave a computer running with the drives spinning for 3 years then if you do have to restart teh drive might fail to spin up do to age. Given that most hard drive warranties are only 1 year (3 is the far limit) that's not unreasonable; if you leave your car running 24/7 you can be sure it'll break well before it's waranty is up, but a computer is happy to just keep on running for twice or three times the waranty length. I think the problem is you only think of a computers life time is only 1 year to 3 at max. And during the 1st 1 year to 2 years there probly is litte notice difrence btween constaly rebooting and laeving it on. But perosnaly i blive that if you pay serveral thousand for somthing it should last for alot more then 3 years at max. Just becues the warrity is only 3 years dose not mean the computer should only last that. |
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| Author: | Ninja [ Wed May 31, 2006 6:56 pm ] |
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Well, good news lol. After a few hours of work this afternoon, we finally got our air conditioner up and running and my house is getting cooler, so im happy . Also my computer room is on the top level of the house so it will take some time for this level to get cool, but its still getting better. What ive thought of getting now, instead of a 50 dollar heat sink, a new fan for the heat sink, and artic silver thermal compound. I asked some people i know at school and they recommended that thermal compound, plus i was also looking around on www.tomshradware.com , some guy had the same problem as i did and everyone recommended he buy a new fan and get artic silver. Well lets see how it turns out |
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| Author: | Blade [ Wed May 31, 2006 8:43 pm ] |
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cpu temp also depends on the processor you have. my athlon 64 3200 venice runs at approx 30C when its cool out. around the same temperature when i had an athlon xp 2500 barton, it used to run around 36C. the thunderbird i had normally ran around 50C. and the other athlon xp 2100 palimino ran around 40-45. also, i think p4's generally run hotter than athlons. |
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| Author: | codemage [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 8:41 am ] |
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Hacker Dan wrote: Have you ever fealt some of the hard drivers form a few years ago when they boot up? They vibreate like crazy, so much so you can feal it threw your computer.
On some of the really old mainframe-style drives, you could literally walk the unit across the floor if you encountered a hard-drive thrashing sequence. Also, if you have your case wide open and *don't* have an outside fan blowing on it - you're greatly reducing the efficiency of your onboard fan by killing the engineered path of airflow. Most cases are designed to run cooler with the case closed. (It sounds a bit counterintuitive, I know.) |
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| Author: | Andy [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 10:45 am ] |
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Ninja wrote: ya, theres no dust in my case i clean it once every week.
I find that hard to believe... cleaning out your case every week |
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| Author: | Clayton [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 11:57 am ] |
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regarding the idea of energy consumption: i've heard that your monitor can use up to 3-4x and sometimes as much as 6-7x as much power as your entire PC (minus the monitor of course), that is the reason my monitor is always off when its not in use |
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| Author: | Blade [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 2:47 pm ] |
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depends on the monitor, LCD's use a considerably less amount of power than CRT's but, i dont think any monitor will use tha tmuch power. my computer draws 350W from my powersupply whereas my LCD is rated for 40W... you cant tell me that a CRT would draw 1050 to 2450W of power? Samsung's 790DF 17" CRT uses 80W of power. The 930BF 19" LCD uses 38W of power. and finally one of their 21" CRT models uses 120W of power. |
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| Author: | Mazer [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:15 pm ] |
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SuperFreak82 wrote: up to 3-4x and sometimes as much as 6-7x
Limits ftw! |
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| Author: | Clayton [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:11 pm ] |
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Blade wrote: depends on the monitor, LCD's use a considerably less amount of power than CRT's
but, i dont think any monitor will use tha tmuch power. my computer draws 350W from my powersupply whereas my LCD is rated for 40W... you cant tell me that a CRT would draw 1050 to 2450W of power? Samsung's 790DF 17" CRT uses 80W of power. The 930BF 19" LCD uses 38W of power. and finally one of their 21" CRT models uses 120W of power. im just saying what i was told by my parents friend who runs a computer store here in town, so i tend to believe him, maybe not LCD, but , thats what i was told  |
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| Author: | Blade [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 10:29 pm ] |
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I can understand where you're coming from, because if one doesn't know much about computers then one would tend to believe someone who deals with them all the time. But I don't see how something as simple as a monitor (being closely related to a TV) could draw as much power as a refridgerator. Because if you think about what power supplies are rated for (not saying you're computer is going to draw that much electricity), then you can get an approximate idea of how much he is saying monitors draw. There are refridgerators that draw 1800W and window air conditioners that draw 1200. I think someone posted earlier that we up at record energy consumption because of the heat. Wouldn't that suck for all the gamers in the world who play 12hrs of WoW when their monitor drew 2400W of power? |
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| Author: | Clayton [ Thu Jun 01, 2006 10:47 pm ] |
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that is true, although these facts arent exactly new either, so i might not have remembered corectly, all i know is that the monitor on some computers had accounted for around at least half of total energy consumption, but whatever, it doesnt matter, the point is older monitors sucked up a lot of energy |
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| Author: | codemage [ Fri Jun 02, 2006 9:40 am ] |
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I think most CRTs are in the 100-200 KWH range. LCDs are much lower. Either way, we're not talking about staggering costs per year, particularly compared to heating/cooling appliances. |
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| Author: | Blade [ Mon Jun 05, 2006 3:31 pm ] |
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i was simply pointing out that there's no way monitors can draw as much power as appliances |
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| Author: | md [ Mon Jun 05, 2006 11:03 pm ] |
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Most monitors are actually in the 75-150KWh range; LCDs are in the 25-40W range. A computer can be comparable to an appliance in power usage though; printer (20 tops) + LCD (35) + CRT (125) + computer (500) + skeakers (100; or in my case [x, where x is BIG]) that's a good 800 right there. Factor in networking gear and you might get yoruself up to 900 or even 1000 W. 'Course those of us who run more then one computer definitely use the power... I think my total is somewhere close to 2KW. |
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| Author: | TheFerret [ Tue Jun 06, 2006 2:14 pm ] |
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Cornflake wrote: Most monitors are actually in the 75-150KWh range; LCDs are in the 25-40W range. A computer can be comparable to an appliance in power usage though; printer (20 tops) + LCD (35) + CRT (125) + computer (500) + skeakers (100; or in my case [x, where x is BIG]) that's a good 800 right there. Factor in networking gear and you might get yoruself up to 900 or even 1000 W.
'Course those of us who run more then one computer definitely use the power... I think my total is somewhere close to 2KW. I would like to know what type of computer uses 500 watts, even though the computer may have a PSU, the real wattage is significantally less than that, like for example, an amd xp 2100 with an ati 5500, 2 hd, 2 optical drives is using close to 120-150 watts... |
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| Author: | md [ Tue Jun 06, 2006 7:54 pm ] |
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Under normal idle conditions a computer may draw less then it's fully laoded condition. However: PSU's use more power then they put out; I have a rediculous amount of hardware in my computers; and they are very rarely running idle. |
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| Author: | codemage [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:02 am ] |
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Computer wattage is an approximate average. PSUs need to be higher than the average (most people will say about 30% higher) because power consumption is a lot higher under peak conditions. The actual wattage of my sys is a bit under 350W. If I didn't have at least a 450W PSU, I'd have huge issues every time the components were stressed. |
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| Author: | Clayton [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:05 pm ] |
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well my power consumption is around the 300-350W range, which if used with my old monitor, would have consumed around 400-450W, as my monitor used about 120W, so... |
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| Author: | War_Caymore [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 1:36 pm ] |
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My new monitor uses up i think... let me check......... ..... ..... ..... ..... ..... it says it's on power save mode, 45kw/h. not bad
Anyways, anyone in the kitchiner waterloo region better watch out this summer, it's gonna b like 35c (or 95-105* for you americans) every dam day. It's best be safe unless you got a nice liquid cooling system (go alienware!!!  ). My comp won't be safe tho, becasue my cooling system jsut broke down and now i can't run anything high end until i can get it fixed. I hope it's just a busted tube... |
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