Computer Science Canada Difference, between net beans and ready.... |
| Author: | magicman [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Difference, between net beans and ready.... |
what is the difference between them??? I know that ready is "the fake java" and that netbeans is the real one.... but realy down to the niddy griddy, what is the difference? |
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| Author: | wtd [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:14 pm ] |
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Netbeans' featureset dwarfs Ready To Program. RTP doesn't include any kind of GUI designer. Netbeans apparently includes one of the slickest around. Netbeans uses Sun's Java compiler which for better or worse is the standard. RTP uses IBM's Java compiler, which is limited to the feature of Java 1.4.2. This wouldn't be so much a problem except that 1.5.0 is much better than 1.4.2. Netbeans runs anywhere Sun's Java runs. RTP is limited to Windows. Netbeans can be freely downloaded. If you want RTP you have to beg someone to send you an illegal copy. |
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| Author: | Tony [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:50 pm ] |
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RTP also employs non-standart libraries that are not documented outside of Holtsoft |
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| Author: | Cervantes [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:29 pm ] |
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wtd wrote: Netbeans' featureset dwarfs Ready To Program. RTP doesn't include any kind of GUI designer. Netbeans apparently includes one of the slickest around.
I don't know what the v4.1 was like for NetBeans for graphics design, but Hikaru79 was writing about NetBeans v1.5 in his blog. |
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| Author: | rizzix [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 8:56 pm ] |
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Eclipse: Free. Great for coding and is an RCP too! Netbeans: Free. Greatest GUI designer. No competition here. It just owns, but poor coding support. Also an RCP! IntelliJ's IDEA: The most superior IDE you'll ever get your hands on for $500  It beats Eclipse and Netbeans put together when it comes to coding. It's GUI designer is not too bad, but it's no match for Matisse (netbeans). Not an RCP. |
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| Author: | Martin [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 11:01 pm ] |
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Does anyone know the board's logic for choosing Ready to Program over actual Java or even another language? The board's choices of language are bizarre. Turing - costs money, windows exclusive, completely useless in the long run. RTP - costs money, windows exclusive, much less useful than actual Java (which is free). Java, Ruby, Pascal or Python seem like smarter choices... Anyone? |
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| Author: | wtd [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:02 am ] |
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"Corporate support" was likely a big issue. Of course, 99% of what Holt seems to be providing support for are problems using their software created in the first place. |
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| Author: | codemage [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 8:57 am ] |
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The choice is based on their choice for Turing. One company provides all the programming support. Also, the interface is identical to the Turing one - in the Board's mind, this eases the transition between the two languages when the students start Java in Gr 11/12. |
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| Author: | Martin [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 9:04 am ] |
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Just goes to show, where there're stupid people, there's money to be made. I think Python should be the language of choice for highschools. |
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| Author: | wtd [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:52 am ] |
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Martin wrote: Just goes to show, where there're stupid people, there's money to be made.
I think Python should be the language of choice for highschools. I'd disagree with that choice. Python has inconsistencies coming out the wazoo. Its community in general is also relatively hostile. |
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| Author: | MysticVegeta [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:39 pm ] |
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I use JCreator cause zylum uses it lol. Is it helpful when I go to intermediate java? |
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| Author: | wtd [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:55 pm ] |
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MysticVegeta wrote: Is it helpful when I go to intermediate java?
What is "intermediate Java"? |
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| Author: | turboliux [ Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:15 am ] |
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i use JCreator too. i like it because its simple while programs like Eclipse and NetBeans have too much features which i dont use right now (high school), for example: Eclipse's "Generate Getters and Setters" for small java application is kinda uselless, coz i can write it myself! This function comes handy when a large program is written with all those classes and linked lists and data objects, etc... So, i think that JCreator is good for learning java in high school, but definately not a best choice for actual work in some company... |
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| Author: | magicman [ Wed Feb 08, 2006 2:03 pm ] |
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what about bluej??? my computer teacher says that its good...... |
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| Author: | Hikaru79 [ Wed Feb 08, 2006 3:56 pm ] |
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magicman wrote: what about bluej??? my computer teacher says that its good......
BlueJ is a bit different. It's not only an IDE, its an actual system for helping students visualize class structures. Yes, it is good, but it can't really be compared to Netbeans; they're not meant to do the same thing, really. |
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| Author: | McKenzie [ Wed Feb 08, 2006 7:29 pm ] |
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I think the decision to use Ready has a lot to do with simple marketing. Holt pushes it's product at conferences. The powers that be like the simple interface and more importantly like the idea of not having to actually evaluate the various products. I actually like RTP for it's simplicity but it's hard to justify PAYING for a clearly inferior product. I'm also not a fan of their textbooks (if you don't want to use the proprietory classes there are about 6 useful pages in the book) |
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| Author: | Martin [ Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:19 am ] |
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I haven't used RTP, but if it's anything like Turing's interface, I think that's a good thing. I think that Turing 4's editor had all of the things that a student needed (a simple debugger, syntax highlighting, code indentation) all contained in a simple package. Is it that much easier to use than actual Java though? |
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| Author: | wtd [ Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:22 am ] |
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Martin wrote: code indentation
From what I've seen RTP's code formatting feature, it produces code that doesn't even remotely resemble Sun's well-known code style guidelines. |
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| Author: | rizzix [ Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:41 am ] |
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Martin wrote: I haven't used RTP, but if it's anything like Turing's interface, I think that's a good thing. I think that Turing 4's editor had all of the things that a student needed (a simple debugger, syntax highlighting, code indentation) all contained in a simple package.
BlueJ - Debugger - Syntax highlighter - Interpreter (which can evaluate mathamatical expressions as well) - Can create an instance of any selected class and test each method visually. - UML diagrams (Use case and Inheritance) (the way java should be taught) - Ability to package the project as a jar file for submission/distribution etc. - Free |
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| Author: | Hikaru79 [ Thu Feb 09, 2006 4:38 pm ] |
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Martin wrote: I haven't used RTP, but if it's anything like Turing's interface, I think that's a good thing. I think that Turing 4's editor had all of the things that a student needed (a simple debugger, syntax highlighting, code indentation) all contained in a simple package.
Is it that much easier to use than actual Java though? The problem isn't the editor's interface; it's generally agreed that it is pretty good in a minimalist sort of way (except for the auto-formatting being against Sun coding convention, but that's not a tragedy). The main problem is the language itself; first of all, they use Jikes instead of Sun's compiler. It is outdated (particularly older RTP versions, which do not even have Swing. That's the version that was installed on the comps at the beginning of the year). Even the "new" is stuck at 1.4. Students are missing out on a lot of cool features that got added in at 1.5. Secondly, they push the "HSA.Console" system on kids. Now, RTP doesn't *force* you to use this, but a lot of teachers will. Bascially it tries to convince kids that they're still doing Turing. If you could change the compiler that RTP is linked to, as well as some basic control over the auto-format, I'd probably use it at home, even, for small one-file edits. |
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| Author: | Martin [ Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:56 am ] |
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If they were smart, they'd just sell the editor along with a simple, turing like graphics library (ie. the Draw module in Turing). I could support buying that. But yeah. Strange world. |
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| Author: | [Gandalf] [ Sat Feb 11, 2006 2:05 pm ] |
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I don't use JCreator because it's way too slow for my Pentium III 500Mhz (where I do about half my Java programming). For me, Crimson Editor, which has syntax highlighting and allows you to create "compile" and "execute" buttons is everything I need. I recommend it for anyone, especially beginners. |
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