Computer Science Canada Japan |
Author: | Martin [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 1:55 am ] |
Post subject: | Japan |
So, well, I've been in Japan for over a month now (I came on September 26th), and I figured I'd write about it. Japan is beautiful. I'm living in Matsumoto, which is surrounded my mountains, and...just wow. It reminds me of British Columbia. The people are all very nice, work is fun (if a bit slow) and getting around is easy and affordable. I've made a ton of friends, both Japanese and some people that I've met through the JET program. The thing that gets me about Japan is how clean everything is. There's rarely any litter on the ground, partly because people just don't litter, and party because companies will often go out once a month or so and pick up garbage. This lack of garbage is strange too, in that there are vending machines everywhere and VERY few public garbage cans. When you do get to a garbage can, there're always 20 of them, where you have to tear apart your garbage sort it by weight, colour, coefficients of friction, index of refraction, bouancy, etc. (actually, there are just 5, but still). I just put everything in the bag that says 'Burnable.' Partying is a blast. I have a new food every day - at least. Sashimi is great - I've even had raw horse meat. I can't say I'm a huge fan of cold soba though. Beer is expensive if only because they don't have pitchers. Also, finding imports is really hard. I miss my Stella Artois - not that Japanese beer is bad. Sake's good cold, not my favourite warm (they serve it both ways). Japanese popular music is, for the most part, pretty bad. It's very manufactured, and it seems like all of the biggest bands have their own line of toys to go with it. That, and singles sell for about $30. I've found some good not so mainstream bands that I like though. Matsumoto is an old castle town (in fact, the castle still exists), so the streets were designed to confuse an invading enemy. Yeah... Stuff is inexplanably expensive here, and there is this strange hip-hop culture. Jeans start at about $100. T-shirts at about $40. Watermellons sell for about $100. Ramen is cheap though ![]() Sexism here is pretty bad. I've given up on Japanese TV because of it. The females on tv are cutesy, pretty, but absolutely weak human beings. If I see another pigeon-toed 25 year old woman with Hello Kitty on her purse I'm going to be sick. Even in real life, when a man gets off the train, him and his wife bow to each other, then she carries his bags, walking behind him. Weird. The Japanese language is both simple and beautiful. There are three alphabets (plus romanji - roman characters). Hiragana and katakana are similar to our alphabet in use (albet with 46 characters), although each letter is strictly phoenetic. Kanji, on the otherhand has 1900 non-phonetic characters. You need to know about 1000 to read a novel. Yikes. Each of these kanji has a meaning associated with it. Tokyo for example, is two kanji - Too 東(pronounced toh-oh), meaning 'east' and Kyoo 京(kyo-oh) meaning capital. So Tokyo is literally translated East Capital. At first, this seemed like overkill (in that if you don't know a kanji, you can't just sound it out), but one of the benefits that it has is that China and, to a more limited extent Korea use the same characters, which allows for written communication although the languages are different. Counting in Japanese is also strange. They have a different counting system for everything. Even food is divided - asking for two bowls of rice is different than asking for two plates of soba. Strangeness. Anyway, I'll add to this as time goes on. |
Author: | codemage [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 10:30 am ] |
Post subject: | |
Quote: Sexism here is pretty bad
That's really really interesting, & a good summary. I'm a bit of a travel nut, so I'm totally interested in any other updates you're willing to post. |
Author: | brenn [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 10:32 am ] |
Post subject: | |
Please post photos, Martin-san! I used to walk behind Tony all the time too, and he got really weirded out. ^^; |
Author: | rizzix [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 10:39 am ] |
Post subject: | |
codemage wrote: Quote: Sexism here is pretty bad
That's really really interesting... |
Author: | Tony [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 10:45 am ] |
Post subject: | |
brenn wrote: I used to walk behind Tony all the time too, and he got really weirded out. ^^;
It's like having a freaking stalker. ![]() ![]() |
Author: | Paul [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:04 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
I... don't really think its sexism as we perceive it exactly. I mean I spent half of my life in an asian country, and that always seems to be the case. I mean, its part of the culture. On the other hand the whole burying girls as they are born thing IS serious. |
Author: | Martin [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:14 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
It's totally sexism. Let me expand though. I think one of the major defining points in North American history was the women's rights movement. Before that, women in North America really were treated like crap. Now, it's not as bad here (in Japan) as it was pre women's rights movement, mostly because of the respect thing that runs through Japanese society. Men don't beat their wives. Women can vote (although on the census, the options for household position include "wife of head of the household"). However, women here are still thought of as being "less than men." As a plus, as soon as you start talking to a Japanese girl as if she's your equal, she's in love with you. ![]() |
Author: | Mr. T [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:20 pm ] |
Post subject: | Alex's Opinion |
rizzix wrote: codemage wrote: Quote: Sexism here is pretty bad
That's really really interesting... eg. Paul's avatar. ![]() |
Author: | Martin [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:03 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Another strange thing about Japan is that they don't use daylight savings time, so it gets light here at about 5am and dark by 5pm. The work day is still 9 - 6 though. Doesn't make any sense - they'd save MILLIONS in energy costs if they shifted the clocks two or three hours. |
Author: | Mazer [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:53 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Martin, have you heard any music by B'z? Or are they included in the "pretty bad popular music" category? Apparently they've been around for quite a long time, I just started listening to their music when Ian lended me one of their CDs (Brotherhood) which I though was pretty cool. Has your comprehension of Japanese gotten to the point that you can actually understand the music? PS, I hate you. EDIT: Perhaps I should make it quite clear. One of my devilish plans includes getting you drunk and having you impregnate somebody. Perhaps quite a few people just to be safe. Anyways, the child(ren) will be raised to hate you, and trained to destroy you. Um, the end, I guess. If you can think of anything that will improve the efficiency of the plan (to kill you, that is) I'd like to hear it. But more importantly, I want to know the above music/language question? |
Author: | Martin [ Mon Oct 31, 2005 9:05 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
I haven't. I'll check them out. I can read the lyrics sometimes :p Children eh? That'd mean I'd have to have sex. Sweet deal. |
Author: | Dan [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 12:29 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Japan |
Martin wrote: Sexism here is pretty bad. I think this stament is prity realtive, if you look at our own socity objectivty you whould come to the same conusltion about north armaican socity. In reality all socitys are prity dam pergusisted at least about somthing. Everywhere peoleop are being juged on and thread in a secrent way b/c of somthing that they can not easly chage nor should they have to, to have repsect of there socity. A person being a living intengentl being should be enought to be treated equatly but every socity seems to have somthing they like to juge them on and use to show they are lesser. Talking about sexism how offten on t.v. do you see the high up boss or "bizness man" as a women? In our socity we are just sexists in difrent ways, our story types are longe blond hair, blue eyes, thin, big brests and long legs. I have yet to meet some one in real life who is realy like the peoleop i see on t.v. here. I am not justing what jappen dose but rather saying that it is a problem with alot of place if not all on this litte planet of ours and despreantly needs chaging. Tho i do not see that haping any time soon, our hole socity is based apoine person A being better then person B. If no in terms of sex or looks then money or some other pointless chariterists that has litte or nothing to do with who they are as a person. |
Author: | Martin [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 12:37 am ] |
Post subject: | |
Oh of course sexism is everywhere, but in Japan, it's really a lot worse than in the US or Canada. I think I explained it pretty well in my above posts. You're absolutely right that we shouldn't judge people, but as it stands, I'd prefer people to be judged based on income instead of gender, as income is something that you at least have some control over. There's a long way to go for both societies, but the trip for Japan is longer. ------ Another strange thing about Japan is racism. It's still legal for a Japanese shop to have a sign that says 'Japanese Only' on their window, and there are a couple of shops in the city like that. Now, it's not widespread, everyone hates the gaijin, but it's there. Another weird thing is that cartoon child pornography is also legal, called lolicon manga. This is sold in 7/11's and other places. Gross. |
Author: | Dan [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 8:57 am ] |
Post subject: | |
I think you baised b/c you where born and rasied in our socity. I blive they both have an equal way to go. Also you do not allways have control over your income and you can be born ritch or poor. |
Author: | codemage [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:44 am ] |
Post subject: | |
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Author: | beard0 [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 10:12 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Alex's Opinion |
Pwned wrote: rizzix wrote: actually sexism is apparent in their Anime's so it's not supprising.. eg. Paul's avatar. ![]() I agree. I think the avatar should be changed. ![]() |
Author: | Tony [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 10:16 am ] |
Post subject: | |
well you clearly have more control over your income than over your gender. I mean.. you could always stop working ![]() Martin's right though - Japan, and the entire asian culture it seems has a much longer way to go to. The problem is that the behavior is largely based on the flawed cultural values that will not be easy to change. For example in asian culture there are (on rare occasions) females in higher business positions. Though during a business lunch or such, they would still be expected to fetch plates and serve tea and whatnot for men of equal, or even lower title than themselves. One thing I can't quite get my head around about asian cultures (both Chinese and Japanese) is the huge ammount of suffixes they have to describe the status relationship between yourself, and the one you're addressing. While Martin-san will simply be courteous, I could use a variety of other endings. Martin-kun - would be used to address Martin as a (male) child, or to simply point out his lesser status. Martin-chan - translated as "little" it could be used as a playful suffix for childhood friends, or a "cute" nickname. It could also be used sarcastically to degrade a person to a level of a child, much like -kun. Schools are very formal, there are suffixes for elder peers (-sempai) and those of lower grade (-kohai). An obvious one that many should be familir with is -sensei for a teacher. Asian schools also have uniforms that vary in style and colour based on the grade one is in. I find it particularly interesting how in North America one of the bigger arguments in favour of uniforms is an attempt to bring in equality between peers, unity and all, and not have kids teased over their choice of clothes; but in asian schools you could see a frosh at the other end of the hallway because of their distinctive colour of the uniform. Strange. |
Author: | lyam_kaskade [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:32 am ] |
Post subject: | |
Martin wrote: Another weird thing is that cartoon child pornography is also legal, called lolicon manga. This is sold in 7/11's and other places. Gross. Is it illegal here? I mean, you don't see it anywhere, but that could just be because there's no real demand for it. I don't see how drawing pictures (of anything really) would be a crime in itself. |
Author: | rizzix [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:09 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Tony wrote: One thing I can't quite get my head around about asian cultures (both Chinese and Japanese) is the huge ammount of suffixes they have to describe the status relationship between yourself, and the one you're addressing. Your're kidding right? There's nothitng wrong with that.. I think it's cool! Besides why would you want to westernize them? Getting rid of bad traditions is good.. but there's no need to complelely emilinate the little things that makes them different... being unique is cool! |
Author: | wtd [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:12 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Tony wrote: Martin's right though - Japan, and the entire asian culture it seems has a much longer way to go to. The problem is that the behavior is largely based on the flawed cultural values that will not be easy to change.
Describing an entire culture as flawed is not the way to change things. It's not enough to know that something is wrong, you have to understand why, and how it got to that point, and why it continues to be wrong, or you'll never affect change. Appreciate someone's culture, and then maybe they'll listen to your ideas. Also, take time to consider that perhaps it's not wrong. The Japanese way of getting things done may not be to your liking, but maybe it works for them as well as our way of doing things does for us... maybe better. |
Author: | rizzix [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:17 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Yes, that is sooo true! |
Author: | codemage [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:55 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
One problem, at least as I understand it is that not changing old traditions is one of the major traditions in Japan. :/ One of the things that we embrace in the west (as part of our lower-case socialist capitalist liberalist worldview) *breath* is that everyone should be given equal opportunity and treated equally in the same circumstances regardless of gender / genetics / beliefs, etc. We push a lot of things on other cultures, and that's another thing, but equality is one thing that pretty much everyone here agrees should be universal. |
Author: | Paul [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 2:21 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
![]() Eh, dunno really how to say this but... In every culture, there's always things like: americans are..., russians are..., australians are..., but they usually do not look within their own cultures for flaws. Plus, proposing change, IMO is really not that useful, the most useful thing you can do is help people become more aware. For example, my generation of people believe that many traditions like "women should have small feet" are just plain silly, yet the older generation firmly believe in it. When they're gone, we'll teach our kids differently, and they'll have different opinions from us. Cultures are always changing, evolving, getting absorbed, what fun is it if everyone had the same culture? They change on their own anyway, the thing that everyone should do is watch out for the people around you, make sure things like sexism isn't hurting anyone you can help, instead of saying how the entire asian culture is flawed. Beardo, screw off, leave my avatar alone. |
Author: | Tony [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 2:56 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
I didn't mean that suffixes were entirely bad. It's just the part where "I'm going to talk to you, and point out that you're of a lower status than I am, every time I mention your name" Paul wrote: the most useful thing you can do is help people become more aware.
Maybe we should join Martin in Japan on a missioner trip ![]() |
Author: | rizzix [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 3:08 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Tony wrote: I didn't mean that suffixes were entirely bad. It's just the part where "I'm going to talk to you, and point out that you're of a lower status than I am, every time I mention your name"
but you see this is exactly what we're is saying.. that may seem to be the case to you.. but it really isin't anything offensive, as such, to them.. |
Author: | wtd [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 3:16 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
It's a statement of fact. It only becomes offensive when you assign an offensive meaning to it. "I'm older than you." Ok. But it becomes a problem when you hear someone say "I'm older than you" and you actually hear: "I'm older than you, so you must be a worthless piece of garbage." |
Author: | Tony [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 4:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
good point, thx guys ![]() |
Author: | Martin [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 7:01 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
I'm only 19, so everyone calls me Martin-kun - the age of adulthood in Japan is 20. Jerks. But Dan, it's not a matter of opinion. Sexism here is definitely much worse. The women's rights movement was really a definitive point in North American culture. Every culture has its flaws, and complex social positions isn't. Sexism in Japan is a result of this, in that everyone has their place in society. Unfortunately, the female's is lower than the male's. |
Author: | Tony [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:57 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Aa, do you use "boku", too? I guess you use "watashi". oO; (obviously it's Bren posting because Tony has hijacked her computer ![]() |
Author: | Dan [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:22 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Tony wrote: Aa, do you use "boku", too? I guess you use "watashi".
oO; (obviously it's Bren posting because Tony has hijacked her computer ![]() I vote that tony gets my pw3d admin rank........... |
Author: | Tony [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:14 pm ] |
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Hacker Dan wrote: I vote that tony gets my pw3d admin rank...........
I vote that I get access to mysql |
Author: | Dan [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 10:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Tony wrote: Hacker Dan wrote: I vote that tony gets my pw3d admin rank...........
I vote that I get access to mysql I am working on it =p........aucatly talk to me on msn, the v3 demo site has a bulit in mysql admin system. |
Author: | Martin [ Sun Nov 13, 2005 7:34 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
More Japanese strangeness. Japan's legal system is a mess. They have bizarre laws designed to protect the wrong people all over the place. Take advertising for example. In Canada, one is allowed to advertise alcohol, however the advertiser must target people aged 19+ with their ads. Showing a bunch of fifteen year olds drinking Keith's would be illegal. Similarly, in the US, one is allowed to advertise cigarettes, but they cannot target people under 21 with their ads. In Japan, these laws apparently don't exist. The legal age to drink/smoke in Japan is twenty, but there are (apparently) no restrictions on the advertising. Too strange. |
Author: | brenn [ Sun Nov 13, 2005 8:34 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Wait, wait, wait. So, Martin, YOU CAN'T DRINK IN JAPAN RIGHT NOW? |
Author: | Martin [ Sun Nov 13, 2005 9:11 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
I can't legally drink in Japan right now. Legally. Not like anyone ever checks ID though. I found out I can get my driving license with just doing an eye test. Next weekend ![]() |
Author: | Mazer [ Sun Nov 13, 2005 9:18 pm ] |
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"Hey dumbasses, you're all on the wrong side of the road!" ![]() |
Author: | md [ Sun Nov 13, 2005 10:03 pm ] |
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woah... martin in a k-car... creepy |
Author: | Martin [ Mon Nov 14, 2005 7:49 pm ] |
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I've come to the conclusion that sashimi contains addictive drugs. New favourite food, by far. Oh man, if only it wasn't so pricey. |
Author: | Martin [ Tue Nov 15, 2005 12:01 am ] |
Post subject: | |
Dan, here are some articles on sexism in Japan. http://www.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/getarticle.pl5?nn20030114b3.htm http://www.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/getarticle.pl5?eo20001029a1.htm |
Author: | codemage [ Tue Nov 15, 2005 10:48 am ] |
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Fascinating. |
Author: | Martin [ Mon Nov 21, 2005 9:20 pm ] |
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Japan really needs to adopt daylight savings time. 5:30pm it's pitch black outside. So stupid. |
Author: | person [ Mon Nov 21, 2005 9:23 pm ] |
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Canada: 5:30, its pitch black outside |
Author: | Hikaru79 [ Mon Nov 21, 2005 11:17 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Martin wrote: Japan really needs to adopt daylight savings time. 5:30pm it's pitch black outside. So stupid.
Doesn't daylight savings time make it dark outside FASTER in the evenings? (In exchange for safer morning driving)? We gained an hour back in October, so when we think it is 5:00, it would normally be 6:00, hence darker. |
Author: | Paul [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 5:11 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Martin wrote: I must say that Japan has the absolute worst drivers that I have ever seen.
Maybe in individual comparisons, japan may be worse, but there's definitely quantity over quality in china ![]() |
Author: | beard0 [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 5:24 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Hikaru79 wrote: Doesn't daylight savings time make it dark outside FASTER in the evenings?
Actually, at this time of year, whether you observe daylight savings or not makes no difference. We are "off" daylight savings time rigth now, and will start observing it again come spring. |
Author: | Martin [ Sat Nov 26, 2005 10:44 am ] |
Post subject: | |
http://www.flickr.com/photos/71514888@N00/ Here are some pictures. I have tons, I'm just lazy uploading them. Lots more to come. |
Author: | md [ Sat Nov 26, 2005 3:04 pm ] |
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Awesome! What's the strangest thing you've seen in a vending machine so far? |
Author: | Amailer [ Sat Nov 26, 2005 3:23 pm ] |
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The vending mechines own... so cool ![]() Have you brought what looks like...coffe from any of them? How do they give the coffe? It is coffe right? AHH COFFE. Anyhow, it looks way more complicated then the ones we got here... so cool. I like the views from top of that..Mo..tomo? something place, looks sweet. |
Author: | Martin [ Sat Nov 26, 2005 3:37 pm ] |
Post subject: | |
Matsumoto. The -jo suffix says that it's a castle. So far the list of things I've seen is: Coffee/tea/softdrinks/etc., cigarettes (at 250 - 300 yen a pack...), alcohol (at 200 yen a pint), ice cream. Sin city man. I'll upload some more pics. |